1. Less than a week to support David Tuller's work. To donate click here.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Guest, the 'News in Brief' for the week beginning 19th October 2020 is here.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Welcome! To read the Core Purpose and Values of our forum, click here.
    Dismiss Notice

Possibility of ME or PVFS after COVID-19, Long Covid

Discussion in 'Epidemics (including Covid-19)' started by Hip, Jan 21, 2020.

  1. Wits_End

    Wits_End Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    594
    Likes Received:
    2,765
    Location:
    UK London
    This is sort of relevant, although it's approaching from entirely the diagonally opposite end of the spectrum, i.e. people who are "fit and healthy":

    http://www.msn.com/en-gb/health/fam...on-new-evidence-shows/ar-BB18lWMt?ocid=ASUDHP

     
  2. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    5,180
    Likes Received:
    43,022
    Location:
    UK
    #MEAction hosted a seminar for covid-19 long-haulers, or people who have contracted covid-19 and are still experiencing symptoms months after the initial illness.
    full video here


    eta:
    Code:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UV9NHTONrJs&feature=emb_logo
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2020
  3. InitialConditions

    InitialConditions Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    495
    Likes Received:
    3,158
    Location:
    UK
    This is the paper the article is based on

    https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11420-020-09777-1

    Considerations for Return to Exercise Following Mild-to-Moderate COVID-19 in the Recreational Athlete

    "The COVID-19 pandemic has resulted in significant morbidity and mortality around the world. The spectrum of COVID-19 is broad, from clinical disease requiring intensive medical care to less severe symptoms that are treated with supportive care. The majority of COVID-19 cases fall into the mild-to-moderate category, with symptoms lasting less than 6 weeks. Nevertheless, the morbidity from COVID-19 is significant and can affect multiple body systems, most frequently the cardiac, pulmonary, hematologic, musculoskeletal, and gastrointestinal systems. For patients who wish to return to exercise after mild-to-moderate COVID-19, the wide range of disease expression presents a challenge for clinicians seeking to offer counsel. This literature review on return to activity following mild to moderate COVID-19 in the recreational athlete includes evidence-based considerations and recommendations for clinicians in guiding the safest return to activity."
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2020
  4. Cheshire

    Cheshire Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    4,001
    Likes Received:
    21,808
    Gaslighted by the Medical System’: The Covid-19 Patients Left Behind

    https://elemental.medium.com/gaslig...he-covid-19-patients-left-behind-3ee0d3419197
     
  5. Cheshire

    Cheshire Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    4,001
    Likes Received:
    21,808
    A dilemma for ‘long-haulers’: Many can’t prove they ever had Covid-19
    by @dave30th

    https://www.statnews.com/2020/08/26/long-haulers-dilemma-many-cannot-prove-they-had-covid19/
     
  6. Tom Kindlon

    Tom Kindlon Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,348
    Likes Received:
    12,812
    Skycloud, MEMarge, Binkie4 and 26 others like this.
  7. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    4,951
    Likes Received:
    39,024
    Location:
    Canada
    Unfortunately this advice is for 2 weeks only, then advises graded exercise afterward. :banghead:

    It's getting incredibly frustrating seeing all the worst possible mistakes being made many times over while we could actually help medicine avoid all of those mistakes and accelerate research, cutting months, if not years, of wasted efforts. Such a stupid system to reject relevant knowledge presented on a silver plate like that.

    All they have to do is listen to the patients. But they just don't want to because medicine still operates like we're in the 15th century and everyone who isn't a medical doctor or a scholar must be an illiterate simpleton. The patients are telling them everything they need to do better and they just spit on it, insist on committing every mistake to its fullest extent.

    We could probably save a full calendar year of wasted efforts, and billions in opportunity cost, right here and now by doing this. But nooooooo, medicine has to be by physicians for physicians, nothing can penetrate the bubble.
     
    EzzieD, Sean, sebaaa and 8 others like this.
  8. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    3,457
    Likes Received:
    34,954
    Location:
    Norway
    MEMarge, ladycatlover, Hutan and 17 others like this.
  9. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    4,951
    Likes Received:
    39,024
    Location:
    Canada
  10. Tom Kindlon

    Tom Kindlon Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,348
    Likes Received:
    12,812
  11. Tom Kindlon

    Tom Kindlon Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,348
    Likes Received:
    12,812
    sebaaa, ScottTriGuy, Andy and 2 others like this.
  12. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    3,457
    Likes Received:
    34,954
    Location:
    Norway
    Columbia Magazine - How COVID-19 Could Reveal the Secrets of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

    Hornig is now undertaking several studies that aim to identify risk factors for ME/CFS among COVID-19 patients and to lay the groundwork for new prevention and treatment strategies. In collaboration with scientists at the LA-based research and advocacy organization Solve ME, for example, she is planning to follow large numbers of people who have recovered from COVID-19 to find out how many develop the syndrome and, hopefully, why.

    “One of the interesting things we’ve seen so far is that some COVID-19 patients who initially seem to be on the path to developing ME/CFS actually start to feel better after four or five months,” she says. “We think that looking closely at these people and comparing them to others who eventually do get diagnosed with ME/CFS could yield valuable insights. Might there be something distinct about their immune systems that makes them more resilient? That could be the kind of discovery that opens up new possibilities for treatment.”
     
  13. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

    Messages:
    10,818
    Likes Received:
    78,195
    Location:
    Hampshire, UK
    Any part of this sound familiar to anyone???
     
  14. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

    Messages:
    10,818
    Likes Received:
    78,195
    Location:
    Hampshire, UK


     
  15. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

    Messages:
    10,818
    Likes Received:
    78,195
    Location:
    Hampshire, UK
     
  16. Tom Kindlon

    Tom Kindlon Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,348
    Likes Received:
    12,812
  17. ukxmrv

    ukxmrv Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    547
    Likes Received:
    3,788
    On other patient forums I belong to (not many) I am seeing post-Covid people join the POTS one but not the ME one.

    Guessing that partly it is possible that they are not getting ME dx because they have not been sick for long enough? Regardless of this I would think that they would be a little curious of ME.
     
  18. Arnie Pye

    Arnie Pye Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    3,229
    Likes Received:
    17,603
    Location:
    UK
    I am seeing comments on Twitter where people with Long Covid seem absolutely desperate to reject and avoid a diagnosis of CFS or ME or any other similar diagnosis. I think the issue is that propaganda has been telling people for many years that people with ME aren't seriously ill, they are just lazy. But the people with Long Covid know that they are really ill not like those people with ME. (sarcasm)

    I have zero belief that Long Covid sufferers will get any real help in the long-term, they'll eventually end up being left to rot, just as people with ME have been unjustly dismissed by many for decades. And of course, a lot of people with Long Covid never got positive tests, so that will mean they are more likely to be gaslighted and dismissed because the assumption will be made that they are attention-seeking hypochondriacs.

    Title : These women's coronavirus symptoms never went away. Their doctors' willingness to help did.
    Link : https://news.yahoo.com/gaslighted-dismissed-women-doctors-dont-191906843.html

    And the British doctor's habit of turning everything into a mental illness is highlighted in neon lights in this article :

    Title : 'Sheer fear': mental health impacts of Covid-19 come to fore
    Link : https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ental-health-impacts-of-covid-19-come-to-fore
     
  19. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    4,951
    Likes Received:
    39,024
    Location:
    Canada
    Yeah, probably just the arbitrary 6 months. Plus we all know that the 6 months thing doesn't mean people get diagnosed after it, it just means when the GP drops them off to fend for themselves in most cases.
     
    ukxmrv, sebaaa, Mithriel and 4 others like this.
  20. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    4,951
    Likes Received:
    39,024
    Location:
    Canada
    I never want to hear a physician whining against pseudoscience ever again. They are some of the worst peddlers out there, just very selective about only accepting one kind. Straight up astrology-level medieval nonsense.

    They are training 3,000 practitioners for a need that does not exist all because they didn't want to spend a fraction of this on actually understanding the issue and preventing it in the first place. What a complete waste of human potential, compounded. They are not only wasting lives to this nonsense but wasting the entire system to prop up a stupid ideological death machine.
     
    sebaaa, EzzieD, Amw66 and 6 others like this.

Share This Page