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UK 21 June 2018 | 3-hour ME debate in Westminster Hall, secured by Carol Monaghan

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS News' started by Sasha, Jun 6, 2018.

  1. Sasha

    Sasha Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  2. Gecko

    Gecko Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    From 13:30 - 16:30.

    Hopefully will be broadcast live.

    I think this precludes a summer House of Commoms debate, but not one in the Autumn. May possibly even help get us an Autumn HoC debate as government response can only be unsatisfactory. Should get a lot more on the record though :)
     
  3. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I'm not 100% sure, but I think that MPs are allowed to 'name names' under Parliamentary privilege, without fear/risk of being sued for libel .............. it's about time that they did rather than anonymising everything (eg those involved with PACE and what lead up to it).

    It's only when you/they see the same names coming up time and again they might begin to realise what's been going on for so long.
     
  4. strategist

    strategist Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    @Jonathan Edwards could you provide expert testimony on the methodological deficiencies of the PACE trial?
     
  5. Matt (@DondochakkaB)

    Matt (@DondochakkaB) Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    I don't think I need to point out the fact that 'shit just got real'. Expect those involved in PACE to come out in full force on this one.

    Expect targeted press releases on the day of the debate, patient/advocate even Scientist/Academic smears. Every angry or careless tweet/forum comment ever typed could be weaved into a hatchett job and used to brand anyone who doesn't agree with them.

    The Briefing of Ministers will naturally happen. I expect them to make attempts to woo Nicky Morgan to their side.

    The strategy going into this needs to be on point. It might help to encourage a counter article which shows how isolated comments from individuals are used to silence the community as a whole and hide the fact that there is a robust, large and diverse opposition to PACE.

    Having said all that, this is a big moment. I hope there are enough resources around to seize it.
     
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  6. LightHurtsME

    LightHurtsME Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Does anyone know which MPs will attend?
     
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  7. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Probably won't know until the day.
     
  8. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Any chance is @dave30th able to attend or provide reference materials?
     
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  9. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't think it's that sort of event. It's a debate between MP's - it's up to them to gather their references and prepare any points they want to make in advance of the debate.
     
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  10. Binkie4

    Binkie4 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I have asked my MP to attend, Ed Davey.
    He currently has a commitment but may be able to be there for part of the time. Won't know until the day before.
    He is Libdem and said they would only usually be allocated one person to speak.
    I don't know if this is set in stone.
     
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  11. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thats kinda what i meant, lots of his articles rebut the PACErs very effectively and would make great references for MPs arguing our side.
    The open letters with dozens of doctors as signatories, the many analyses of LP, the accusations against anyone who asks questions in good faith, the money spent to prevent PACE coming out that kind of thing would be great evidence for an MP to have prepared.
    Are we in communication with any of the MPs?
     
  12. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    @Alvin MPs are representatives of a geographically constituency so those of us in the UK have /should write to our local MP.
     
  13. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    the briefing doc for MPs that ME Action coordinated has a short section on PACE and links out to the S4ME PACE briefing doc
     
  14. dave30th

    dave30th Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Can someone explain the process here to non-UK people? I thought last week Monaghan was just getting signers for a motion, and suddenly a debate got scheduled. How did that happen so quickly? And then there are Westminster debates vs. House of Commons debates and the difference is...? And this one is which? So the goal of this current debate is to do what exactly...? And the debate is televised and/or open to the general public? Is the goal to move specific legislation or just to air the issues in a broader way than the last debate a few months ago?
     
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  15. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    as a backbencher there is limited time for debate which is controlled by the backbench committee which Carol M et al put their case to last week. following that committees decision the debate has been given time on 21 June in Westminster Hall. Westminster Hall debates were created a few years ago to give more time for backbenchers to raise debates as they dont depend on the limited time in the House of Commons chamber. The debate is likely to be televised the 30 minute one in February was and that was a Westminster Hall debate

    I dont know about public access for westminster hall- i will try to find out - if in the main chamber there are public galleries

    the briefing document for MPs lists a few asks - its not a change to legislation that would be a private members bill http://www.meaction.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/ME_Briefing_21_June_2018.pdf

    ETA yes there is public access to Westminster Hall debates https://www.parliament.uk/visiting/visiting-and-tours/watch-committees-and-debates/debates/
     
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  16. dave30th

    dave30th Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks, that's helpful. So part of the success of this depends on how many MPs decide to spend their time to attend? Or is the main goal really to put sound bites and memes into public circulation via media exposure?
     
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  17. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    yes there was a good turnout to the 30 minute debate - cross party is a big part of it as well and some of the supporters are senior MPs - Nicky Morgan former Conservative minister and current Select Committee Chair, Vince Cable is leader of Liberal Democrat Party.

    Judging by having 6 MPs presenting the request to the backbench committee when all the other topics looked to have one or maybe two I am hoping that is a sign there will be a good turnout.

    Even if MPs didnt sign the EDM now the debate is happening there is a fresh angle for people to ask them to attend. I asked mine to discuss with Nicky Morgan and hoping NM will influence her to be there
     
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  18. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    The cynical view would be that it's a way of backbench MP's giving their constituents the impression they are making a difference by holding and taking part in a debate on a subject their constituents have raised with them. Representatives from each party give prepared speeches and can be asked questions, then everyone goes home and nobody hears anything more about it.

    The hopeful view might be that as a result of the debate the government decides to do something about it...

    At least it raises the profile of ME in the consciousness of some MP's and the debate is put on record, so the government can't pretend not to be aware of the problem.

    There is a small public gallery for House of Commons debates, and presumably for Westminster Hall debates, but the public don't get to say anything, they just sit and watch.
     
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  19. chrisb

    chrisb Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  20. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    agreed and Im pretty cynical
    however the government will, as in the 30 minute debate, have to be represented by Ministers answering the points raised in debate. So the Minister has to stand up and go on record, the civil servants have to put together briefing, a 3 hour debate is going to be more wide ranging and able to probe for more depth of response than 30 minutes it is going to take a lot more briefing and effort. I agree this is not going to achieve a sea change in the govt approach but it is a concerted campaign stepping up the pressure towards the govt departments.

    and like the guy on the backbench committee said if CM and colleagues arent satisfied by the government response there's a further debate in the Commons chamber available

    Also there's gaining credibility of the issue among MPs seeing that fellow MPs are supporting hopefully will gain interest and make them more open minded to approaches from constituents

    I realise that Dr Gibson did a lot of work before in the commons with his review but a lot of the current MPs werent around then so this work has to be done again unfortunately
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2018
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