Paul Garner on Long Covid and ME/CFS - BMJ articles and other media.

MrMagoo said:
sadly the Google translate wouldn’t turn it into English and I don’t really understand much Norwegian, so I treated myself to Dave Tuller’s excoriating blog which was linked in the article.
Click to expand...
Weird, it works for me! Maybe you can use the translate function in your browser? I know chrome has one, and I just assume the others do as well.
 
Utsikt said:
Here is a summary by Sissel Sunde in response to an article by the Norwegian tabloid (and LP-cheer squad) Dagbladet about PG:
https://translate.google.com/transl...21/09/15/hva-dagbladet-visste-om-paul-garner/
Click to expand...
Translation also works for me. It's a 2021 document. Here's a key bit:

  • "Prof. Garner fell ill in mid-March, and has been featured in at least 85 articles and TV interviews since then.
  • On October 5th he writes in a private email that he walks 5 km per day (new revelation)
  • On October 15th, he writes in a new private email that he has also started cycling (new revelation)
  • On October 30th, he tells the WHO press conference that he has been sick for 7 months.
  • On November 1, Dagbladet shares a video of Garner from the WHO, where his last words about Long Covid are: “it isn't in your head.”
  • On November 25th he is on a diving trip in Grenada , shares photos on FB and writes, among other things, “I needed the rest to be honest.” (new revelation)
  • On January 25th, a blog post is published in the BMJ where he claims to have thought himself cured of Long Covid and supposedly ME/CFS.

    It was in his head anyway, and like other LP activists, he seems to believe that then it must apply to everyone.

    Gone is the gratitude for the advice he received from ME patients about “pacing” at the beginning (activity adjustment). Advice that he had previously given helped him.

    Gone is also the gratitude for the support in FB groups. Instead, the patients are thrown under the bus, and the article appears to have been written following guidance from Recovery Norway.

    He also states that he contracted Dengue fever on the trip – a couple of months after he recovered. Which may indicate a very long vacation, as he considered himself sick on October 30 (cf. WHO), and was in Grenada 3 weeks later. So perhaps the vacation also contributed to his getting back on his feet? Together with the pacing at first? Because why else would he need more rest, if he was already healthy?"

The time line is consistent with a natural recovery from a post-viral fatigue syndrome (which is definitely not to say that this wasn't also ME/CFS). PG's statements throughout that time are also consistent with that, with fluctuations in health but a trend of increasing activity. There is no need to invoke the magic of mind over matter - lots of people recover in the first year of a post-viral fatigue syndrome.
 
Howard Schubiner mentions PG in this podcast

https://open.spotify.com/episode/40CUczxOiNU869PxOqhkHZ?si=dg1iTGTkQ3WhSHc6xGDB0A

He says that they are good friends and PG had a "click" moment, where he understood that his symptoms were mild-body, because sometimes he could cycle further and not feel too bad and some times he did less and felt worse. He concluded that PEM made no sense to him because it was so inconsistent, so the symptoms must be mind-body and he could therefore unlearn them. This is the classical conditioning/fear response paradigm for ME.

This conversation sent me down an absolute rabbit hole to investigate mind-body symptoms, as discussed further on this thread: https://www.s4me.info/threads/brain...e-cfs-and-long-covid-discussion-thread.40713/
 
JellyBabyKid said:
Howard Schubiner mentions PG in this podcast

https://open.spotify.com/episode/40CUczxOiNU869PxOqhkHZ?si=dg1iTGTkQ3WhSHc6xGDB0A

He says that they are good friends and PG had a "click" moment, where he understood that his symptoms were mild-body, because sometimes he could cycle further and not feel too bad and some times he did less and felt worse. He concluded that PEM made no sense to him because it was so inconsistent, so the symptoms must be mind-body and he could therefore unlearn them. This is the classical conditioning/fear response paradigm for ME.

This conversation sent me down an absolute rabbit hole to investigate mind-body symptoms, as discussed further on this thread: https://www.s4me.info/threads/brain...e-cfs-and-long-covid-discussion-thread.40713/
Click to expand...
Amazing that he ever questioned whether it actually was PEM, given that it was so inconsistent for him and that more exercise didn’t induce it….
 
JellyBabyKid said:
Howard Schubiner mentions PG in this podcast

https://open.spotify.com/episode/40CUczxOiNU869PxOqhkHZ?si=dg1iTGTkQ3WhSHc6xGDB0A

He says that they are good friends and PG had a "click" moment, where he understood that his symptoms were mild-body, because sometimes he could cycle further and not feel too bad and some times he did less and felt worse. He concluded that PEM made no sense to him because it was so inconsistent, so the symptoms must be mind-body and he could therefore unlearn them. This is the classical conditioning/fear response paradigm for ME.

This conversation sent me down an absolute rabbit hole to investigate mind-body symptoms, as discussed further on this thread: https://www.s4me.info/threads/brain...e-cfs-and-long-covid-discussion-thread.40713/
Click to expand...

I always feel worse when I cycle further (I have a throttle driven ebike but can pedal a bit). I've been riding it for almost 15 years. If breaking a fear/response loop was going to work, it would have happened by now.

It's so sad that he projects his own experiences onto everyone else.
 
Paul Garner is interviewed in an article about doctors and patient activists in the journal for the Finnish Medical Association.

google translation: In the teeth of activists

quote:
What to do if you find yourself caught in the teeth of activism?

Garner contacted the university and the police. They took the matter seriously. Interpol also got involved. Support also came from colleagues.

– Stay strong. Get off social media. Ask for help from the organization and try to find support from others who have a similar view. The goal is to isolate the person from the group and silence them. Don't care about them. Stick to your message and continue communicating.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom