Ketogenic diet

sb4 said:
No but I wouldn't be worried about giving it a try. When I entered ketosis (usual in morning) and my POTS increased, all I need do is eat some carbs and wait 30-60mins and then I was back to normal.
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My worry is really that my OI getting worse will make it impossible to push through to the other side, though! :) But it's good to hear that it's possible to get back to normal so quickly, if necessary.
 
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Sasha said:
Has anyone had problems with their OI when transitioning onto the keto diet?

I ask because a few years ago I attempted intermittent fasting but tended to become faint and so my doctor advised me to give it up.
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What was your experience, @Ryan31337?
 
Are there any good books about the basics and priniciples of keto, written by someone trustworthy? Not recipes and diet plans, but the ideas, biology, strategies, pitfalls, etc.?

There are tons of books on Amazon but I don't want to have to plough through everyone's credentials!
 
Sasha said:
Are there any good books about the basics and priniciples of keto, written by someone trustworthy? Not recipes and diet plans, but the ideas, biology, strategies, pitfalls, etc.?

There are tons of books on Amazon but I don't want to have to plough through everyone's credentials!
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The authoritative text on KD in childhood epilepsy is by the group at Johns Hopkins where this diet has been used for many decades.

Amazon product ASIN B00EL9DCUG
I don't know of any keto long term studies in normal adults but there are long term studies of children with epilepsy which of course should be taken with a grain of salt since some of these kids have severe congenital metabolic disorders so their adverse outcomes are not necessarily relevant.

In this study they followed up patients for a mean of 9 years https://www.seizure-journal.com/article/S1059-1311(11)00168-3/fulltext#sec0045

Side effects listed were:

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leokitten said:
I don’t know where she got those reports because I haven’t found them on any forum. And you have to take everything with a grain of salt, if there were a couple people who did you have no idea what their health situation was ME or otherwise, and you have no idea what kind of keto they were doing, healthy or not. There is so much we don’t know about the people behind the avatars here on forums. People don’t usually divulge all their health info and problems.
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The Atkins craze comes and goes in waves, typically every decade or so. The people who experience no benefit or get wrecked discontinue the diet, leave the forums and pursue other things or join private forums and facebook groups or go down the naturopath route and get dx with things like "adrenal fatigue". The ones who stick around evangelizing on forums are the ones who do well which is how it is with all treatments.

Edited to add: a friend of mine died a couple of years ago in her early 60s of heart failure after almost a decade of enthusiastically following the ketogenic diet but you'd never know since her death wasn't announced on her blog which is still up so anyone stumbling across it now would think everything is great.
 
Sid said:
The authoritative text on KD in childhood epilepsy is by the group at Johns Hopkins where this diet has been used for many decades.

Amazon product ASIN B00EL9DCUG
I don't know of any keto long term studies in normal adults but there are long term studies of children with epilepsy which of course should be taken with a grain of salt since some of these kids have severe congenital metabolic disorders so their adverse outcomes are not necessarily relevant.

In this study they followed up patients for a mean of 9 years https://www.seizure-journal.com/article/S1059-1311(11)00168-3/fulltext#sec0045

Side effects listed were:

View attachment 3918
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Thanks, Sid, but I can't see that Amazon link - could you post the title and author, please?
 
ive only cut out beige carbs in my diet - no sugar, fruit juice, processed food, pasta, bread etc etc not a full on keto although I am thinking of moving further that way

anyway I just picked up a copy of my medical records and it includes a print out from recent blood tests which I didnt get the results for at the time as the GP didnt see anything she wanted to follow up on

my HB1AC is within the normal range now as it previously had been slightly into pre diabetic and notably, given Im eating more eggs, fish, meat and cheese (not cow dairy tho), my triglicerides are down 0.3 to 1.4 and cholesterol is down 1.0 to 5.2 presumably because as well as eating more fat & protein Im eating more veggies/salad too and healthy fats like avocado and nuts.

just need to get my portions down to more sensible sizes so I can start losing weight again (I have a lot more weight to drop) trouble is I like food ;)
 
@leokitten - was your 48-hour fast a standard thing that you read about somewhere, or was it something of your own invention? (I've been googling on it to no effect!)
 
Sid said:
The Atkins craze comes and goes in waves, typically every decade or so. The people who experience no benefit or get wrecked discontinue the diet, leave the forums and pursue other things or join private forums and facebook groups or go down the naturopath route and get dx with things like "adrenal fatigue". The ones who stick around evangelizing on forums are the ones who do well which is how it is with all treatments.
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@Sid I apologize but ketogenic != Atkins. With Atkins you replace carbs with as much protein as you want (and the fats that come with it). Ketogenic you only eat the amount of protein your body needs and no more and you replace carbs with healthy fats.
 
Sid said:
Ketogenic Diets: Treatments for Epilepsy and Other Disorders
by Eric H. Kossoff MD (Author), John M. MD Freeman (Author), LDN Turner Zahava RD CSP(Author), James E. MD Rubenstein (Author)
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Here's a long-term study on the ketogenic diet in (mostly) adults with epilepsy. Mean diet time was 9 months, with five patients continuing for >= 23 months. "The diet was generally well-tolerated, but undesired weight loss and constipation were the most frequent adverse effects."

Ketogenic diet in adolescents and adults with epilepsy.
[URL='https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=Nei%20M%5BAuthor%5D&cauthor=true&cauthor_uid=24675110']Nei M, Ngo L, Sirven JI, Sperling MR. Seizure.[/URL] 2014 Jun;23(6):439-42.
 
Sasha said:
@leokitten - was your 48-hour fast a standard thing that you read about somewhere, or was it something of your own invention? (I've been googling on it to no effect!)
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Sorry I'm very busy today... just keep searching it's there. It isn't required but it is used to jump start and help you get into ketosis. Otherwise it can take much longer...
 
leokitten said:
@Sid I apologize but ketogenic != Atkins. With Atkins you replace carbs with as much protein as you want (and the fats that come with it). Ketogenic you only eat the amount of protein your body needs and no more and you replace carbs with healthy fats.
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Atkins induction phase is ketogenic at <20 grams of carb / day and many people restrict protein intake to get into deeper ketosis.
 
Did I read correctly that to calculate how many grams of protein you need, you need to know what % of your weight is fat (so you know that the remainder is lean body weight, which you need for the calculation)?

If so, how can you find that out? My muscles are so wasted that no normal way of estimating this - as opposed to directly measuring it - is likely to work. In the UK, Boots used to have weighing machines in their stores that also measured your fat percentage but they don't seem to have them now.

Edit: I see you can buy bathroom scales that claim to do this! :jawdrop: Are they likely to be accurate enough? I see a set on Amazon for only £15.
 
Are there any food calculators for the keto diet that aren't apps (for those who aren't mobile enough to have mobile devices!)?
 
Sasha said:
Did I read correctly that to calculate how many grams of protein you need, you need to know what % of your weight is fat (so you know that the remainder is lean body weight, which you need for the calculation)?
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I understood that to mean simply how much you would weigh if you're not overweight. I assume that would equate to something in the range of weight that would give you a normal BMI. (Body mass index). So as an example, if you weigh 80kg, but a normal weight for your age, gender and height is around 60kg, then you would eat 60g of protein.
 
Trish said:
I understood that to mean simply how much you would weigh if you're not overweight. I assume that would equate to something in the range of weight that would give you a normal BMI. (Body mass index). So as an example, if you weigh 80kg, but a normal weight for your age, gender and height is around 60kg, then you would eat 60g of protein.
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In a post at the other place, @leokitten defines lean weight as total weight minus body fat. (Before I read that, I hadn't even noticed the word 'lean'!).
 
Because of muscle wastage, although my BMI is good, I expect to be carrying a massive proportion of fat. :(
 
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