Thread on Apparent risks of postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome diagnoses after COVID-19 vaccination and SARS-Cov-2 Infection (Nature Cardiovascular Research, 2022).
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Covid-19 vaccines and vaccinations
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Samuel
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
tldr if you get covid but are unvaccinated vaccine might help prevent lc. hope i got that one right.
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Source: WebMD
Date: December 7, 2022
Author: Lisa O'Mary
URL: https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/985222
Vaccines are effective against Long COVID: Study
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Getting at least one dose of a COVID-19 vaccine decreases the chances of having symptoms beyond 3 weeks or developing long COVID, a new analysis shows.
When compared to people who got no vaccine at all, a single dose of Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, or the Janssen vaccine was 29% effective at preventing long COVID. The protection was strongest (35% effective) for those who were vaccinated before being infected with the coronavirus. Post-infection vaccination also helped (27% effective).
Since the analysis 'showed a significant reduction of post-COVID-19 conditions with the vaccine even after having COVID-19, vaccine should be offered to unvaccinated individuals who have had COVID-19,' the authors wrote.
The study was published this week by Cambridge University Press in the journal Antimicrobial Stewardship & Healthcare Epidemiology.
https://www.cambridge.org/core/jour...metaanalysis/0AD0EDEC8C9CC9DF455752E32D73147B
Researchers analyzed data for 1.6 million people from 10 studies published from December 2019 to April 2022. The studies they selected evaluated COVID-19 vaccine effectiveness by comparing outcomes for vaccinated and unvaccinated people. Specifically, the researchers looked at how many people had symptoms present 3 or more weeks after having COVID-19.
'The most common symptoms were fatigue or muscle weakness, muscle pain, anxiety, impaired memory, sleep difficulties, and shortness of breath,' according to a summary of the analysis.
Up to 23 million people in the United States are believed to have long COVID, according to the US Department of Health and Human Services. Among people who have been infected with COVID-19, the CDC estimates that 13.3% have symptoms for a month or longer, and 2.5% have symptoms for 3 months or longer. Long COVID was included in protections under the Americans With Disabilities Act starting in July 2021.
The study authors cautioned that their findings have limits and said that they could not evaluate the effectiveness of vaccines for long COVID among people with weakened immune systems because of a lack of data. A more standardized definition of long COVID is needed 'for research and clinical purposes,' they wrote.
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(c) 2022 WebMD LLC.
===
Source: WebMD
Date: December 7, 2022
Author: Lisa O'Mary
URL: https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/985222
Vaccines are effective against Long COVID: Study
------------------------------------------------
Getting at least one dose of a COVID-19 vaccine decreases the chances of having symptoms beyond 3 weeks or developing long COVID, a new analysis shows.
When compared to people who got no vaccine at all, a single dose of Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, or the Janssen vaccine was 29% effective at preventing long COVID. The protection was strongest (35% effective) for those who were vaccinated before being infected with the coronavirus. Post-infection vaccination also helped (27% effective).
Since the analysis 'showed a significant reduction of post-COVID-19 conditions with the vaccine even after having COVID-19, vaccine should be offered to unvaccinated individuals who have had COVID-19,' the authors wrote.
The study was published this week by Cambridge University Press in the journal Antimicrobial Stewardship & Healthcare Epidemiology.
https://www.cambridge.org/core/jour...metaanalysis/0AD0EDEC8C9CC9DF455752E32D73147B
Researchers analyzed data for 1.6 million people from 10 studies published from December 2019 to April 2022. The studies they selected evaluated COVID-19 vaccine effectiveness by comparing outcomes for vaccinated and unvaccinated people. Specifically, the researchers looked at how many people had symptoms present 3 or more weeks after having COVID-19.
'The most common symptoms were fatigue or muscle weakness, muscle pain, anxiety, impaired memory, sleep difficulties, and shortness of breath,' according to a summary of the analysis.
Up to 23 million people in the United States are believed to have long COVID, according to the US Department of Health and Human Services. Among people who have been infected with COVID-19, the CDC estimates that 13.3% have symptoms for a month or longer, and 2.5% have symptoms for 3 months or longer. Long COVID was included in protections under the Americans With Disabilities Act starting in July 2021.
The study authors cautioned that their findings have limits and said that they could not evaluate the effectiveness of vaccines for long COVID among people with weakened immune systems because of a lack of data. A more standardized definition of long COVID is needed 'for research and clinical purposes,' they wrote.
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(c) 2022 WebMD LLC.
Tara Green
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
Am I right in saying that the science does not support vaccination? I've been following Dr John Campbell on youtube and watching it all unfold. There is a parliamentary debate on there claiming these mrna vaccs are a massive medical scandal.
No. There's plenty of evidence that vaccines reduce severity of disease and death rates.
TigerLilea
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
From the sounds of it, there are a lot of problems with the vaccines that the pharmaceutical companies did not report. For example AstraZeneca knew from the trials that people were getting serious neurological problems, heart problems, and that some people were later being diagnosed with lymphoma and it was not reported. Death rates (not related to covid) in the UK and the US are higher than normal for the past two years since the vaccines were introduced.
The vaccines might have helped to reduce severity of disease and death rates directly from covid, but what are the long term effects of the vaccines going to be? We don't know yet.
Binkie4
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
Mr Andrew Bridgen MP, in the House of Commons earlier this week, led the discussion on adverse effects of the covid vaccines. There seemed to be only 5/6 MPs there to hear his interesting speech with relevant information on big pharma and some figures on vaccine safety and potential harms.
https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commo...47DD-A79C-4EFD10F10C2D/VaccinesPotentialHarms
If you prefer it in visual form, see Dr Campbell's utube, posted 13th Dec
https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commo...47DD-A79C-4EFD10F10C2D/VaccinesPotentialHarms
If you prefer it in visual form, see Dr Campbell's utube, posted 13th Dec
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Here's some data that might help:
Deaths involving COVID-19 by vaccination status, England: deaths occurring between 1 January 2021 and 31 May 2022
And this paper:
CCBY Open access
Research
Risk of thrombocytopenia and thromboembolism after covid-19 vaccination and SARS-CoV-2 positive testing: self-controlled case series study
Hippisley-Cox et al, 2021
Those two sources of evidence seem pretty clear to me. Vaccination reduces the risk of mortality from Covid, and infection is far more dangerous than vaccination.
Deaths involving COVID-19 by vaccination status, England: deaths occurring between 1 January 2021 and 31 May 2022
More at link.
And this paper:
CCBY Open access
Research
Risk of thrombocytopenia and thromboembolism after covid-19 vaccination and SARS-CoV-2 positive testing: self-controlled case series study
Hippisley-Cox et al, 2021
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Those two sources of evidence seem pretty clear to me. Vaccination reduces the risk of mortality from Covid, and infection is far more dangerous than vaccination.
rvallee
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
35% and 27% effective don't really amount to effective in any book. The constant need for hopium has distorted the value of words. Such low efficacy would amount to defective to the point of being taken out of circulation in most contexts.
Imagine touting a birth control method that is 33% effective. Or buying a machine that works 33% of the time. It boggles the mind.
Clearly pretty effective against severe illness, although the combination of needing constant boosters and the hopium-based need to declare the pandemic over will eventually make this nil.
But this is not effective against Long Covid, which so far is almost only ever used in this context. They don't respect it as anything else but a way to spread the hopium.
Imagine touting a birth control method that is 33% effective. Or buying a machine that works 33% of the time. It boggles the mind.
Clearly pretty effective against severe illness, although the combination of needing constant boosters and the hopium-based need to declare the pandemic over will eventually make this nil.
But this is not effective against Long Covid, which so far is almost only ever used in this context. They don't respect it as anything else but a way to spread the hopium.
I agree the vaccines are far from ideal. Scientists are working to try to develop better ones. It's like flu vaccine. Nowhere near 100% effective, but they still prevent a lot of serious disease and deaths.
Serious side effects and deaths from vaccines are tragic but the alternative without vaccines is far higher rates of serious disease and death in those who catch covid while unvaccinated.
As for long covid, sadly vaccines don't prevent that either, but I think I recall correctly that we have somewhere on the forum data showing reduced rates of long covid in vaccinated compared to unvaccinated people.
Serious side effects and deaths from vaccines are tragic but the alternative without vaccines is far higher rates of serious disease and death in those who catch covid while unvaccinated.
As for long covid, sadly vaccines don't prevent that either, but I think I recall correctly that we have somewhere on the forum data showing reduced rates of long covid in vaccinated compared to unvaccinated people.
It’s an adjournment debate these are always short. The Hansard link shows the full thing it’s not just a speech from Bridgen there’s a response from the Minister. In this case it’s Maria Caulfield (a nurse who worked on Covid wards)
Kitty
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
But if there's nothing else available to heterosexuals, other than avoidance of sex? Birth control probably had that kind of effectiveness or less for millennia, but I doubt it put anyone off trying to reduce the odds of conceiving if they didn't want a pregnancy.
Same with Covid, especially when it was still killing and severely disabling large numbers of people. It was either do everything you could to shift the odds in your favour, or isolate completely.
RedFox
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
Yes, the effectiveness of the current vaccines is disappointing. The CDC says the bivalent booster is around 40% effective for those age 18-49. (To find, Search 'Table 2'.) But that's a naturalistic study where I believe many of the unvaxxed had some immunity from previous infections. And they're safe so no real downside. (This is a general statement. People who've had severe adverse reactions should obviously discuss with their doctor.)
I haven't looked to see if there's any published data, but interested in this because a (previously healthy) colleague developed a rapidly growing, life-threatening mediastinal lymphoma within, I think it was, two-three weeks of vaccination. Fortunately they knew the symptoms/signs of SVC obstruction and got help quickly. Their oncologist was definitive that it was secondary to the vaccination, but I don't know whether that was based on histological sampling and tumour genetics or simply history and a few other similar cases. Melted just as rapidly with steroids and excellent recovery, but quite frightening to say the least.
Obviously the COVID vaccines saved a lot of lives, but they are not without issues and there's a lot we can learn: whether it's the biology of the spike protein or the delivery technology (see Innate immune mechanisms of mRNA vaccines, Cell: Immunity, Nov 2022).
ETA: Just checked back through my messages and they would have been diagnosed three weeks after my #1 primary series, so I expect they were around the same mark, as I don't think I had dawdled about getting the vaccine once it was offered to healthcare workers here.
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ahimsa
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
Stat News posted this article today:
Studies indicate updated Covid boosters effective at reducing need for medical care
https://www.statnews.com/2022/12/16/covid-boosters-effective/
Studies indicate updated Covid boosters effective at reducing need for medical care
https://www.statnews.com/2022/12/16/covid-boosters-effective/
cassava7
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
The 43% effectiveness rate is an absolute one (all groups included). The CDC conducted a subanalysis by time since the last monovalent dose (Table 3) and found that the effectiveness against infection of the bivalent booster compared to people who received their last monovalent dose 8 months ago or prior, but no bivalent vaccination since, is:
- 56% (95% CI 53-58) for people aged 18-49
- 48% (45-51) for people aged 50-64
- 43% (39-46) for people aged 65 or more
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mango
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
Let's not forget to include bi and pan folks
Preprint from Cleveland Clinic: over 50,000 employees evaluated from the time the bivalent booster became available. Not particularly encouraging and supports the 40% vaccine effectiveness figure mentioned a few posts up-thread. Notable additional finding of an apparent and unfavourable dose-response relationship between number of prior vaccinations and subsequent infection (doesn't evaluate severity).
Effectiveness of the Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) Bivalent Vaccine (2022, Medrxiv)
Effectiveness of the Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) Bivalent Vaccine (2022, Medrxiv)
Abstract said:
The impact of pre-existing cross-reactive immunity on SARS-CoV-2 infection and vaccine responses (2022, Nature Reviews Immunology)
Jonathan Edwards
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
Bulk symptoms from a lymphoma of three weeks duration sounds near physically impossible to me. Lymphomas can double in size in weeks but you need an awful lot of doublings from an original malignant cell to get to a kilogram of tumour.
I don't actually see how the oncologist could know whether there was a link to a vaccine, unless there is some recognised type I have nit heard of. I don't keep up with the recent output but `I would have expected to have heard about a known link to a lymphoma type.
rvallee
Senior Member (Voting Rights)
This is the time bomb that will blow up in the next few months. Thanks to constant minimization and messaging that it's over, recent booster uptake is somewhere on the order of 10-15%. 2023 could look a lot like 2020, except with no measures, no effective medication and a population weakened by too many bouts of illness. Immunity has a cost, it's not magical and infinite.
This is why telling the truth is supposed to be a principle in public health. That no one follows any of the principles says a lot about how little words mean, whether they are oaths, duties or principles.