Recording of PIP assessment

K

Kelly

Established Member
Hi! I was absolutely gobsmacked today to find out that the recording of my PIP assessment has not been used by the DM at the MR stage. This is because the DWP never request the recording from the IAS. This is because they need permission from the HCP to listen to it and also they don’t have the facility to listen to it or download it from anywhere. Very helpful lady at the DWP mandatory reconsideration telephone support team listened to my rantings for well over an hour, she also read through my original claim and my MR letter. Unfortunately there was nothing she could do to help but the conversation sparked the idea that I should put the transcript from my recording in with my appeal form. In addition, she said that the DM should have referenced that they hadn’t listened to my recording because I referenced it multiple times in my MR letter, so that’s more evidence for tribunal, at least.

Is anyone else aware of these recordings not being used for anything?
 
Kelly said:
Hi! I was absolutely gobsmacked today to find out that the recording of my PIP assessment has not been used by the DM at the MR stage. This is because the DWP never request the recording from the IAS. This is because they need permission from the HCP to listen to it and also they don’t have the facility to listen to it or download it from anywhere. Very helpful lady at the DWP mandatory reconsideration telephone support team listened to my rantings for well over an hour, she also read through my original claim and my MR letter. Unfortunately there was nothing she could do to help but the conversation sparked the idea that I should put the transcript from my recording in with my appeal form. In addition, she said that the DM should have referenced that they hadn’t listened to my recording because I referenced it multiple times in my MR letter, so that’s more evidence for tribunal, at least.

Is anyone else aware of these recordings not being used for anything?
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I've heard this before too. Recordings also won't be used in most tribunals due to time, although a transcript done by a neutral and approved third party (which costs money) can be submitted and is more likely to be read.

In some cases, having a witness who takes notes is as good/better than a recording, because it's cheaper and if they're qualified (such as being a social worker or lawyer), their testimony is very convincing.
 
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adambeyoncelowe said:
I've heard this before too. Recordings also won't be used in most tribunals due to time, although a transcript done by a neutral and approved third party (which costs money) can be submitted and is more likely to be read.

In some cases, having a witness who takes notes is as good/better than a recording, because it's cheaper and if they're qualified (such as being a social worker or lawyer), their testimony is very convincing.
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Thank you for that information. I wish I had known before I spent £60 on recording equipment! I can’t afford to get it professionally transcripted, my partner did it (he was also at the assessment), but I’m still going to submit the transcript. As disappointing as this is, at least I have a more realistic idea of reality now.
 
Very sorry you're having to go through this Kelly, I hope the transcript will be taken into account in the tribunal. Are there not rules and regs which say they must be taken into account?

For the most relevant bits in the transcript, can you add times for the recording so they could more easily access the critical bits and that might mitigate it not being done by an independent person, cos they could hear it for themselves.

How appalling that the DWP are allowing the recordings but that they then ignore them!
 
Kelly said:
Is anyone else aware of these recordings not being used for anything?
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"
Capita state this,

Audio recording

Should you wish, you may use your own equipment to record the face-to-face consultation. This must be undertaken in line with the following DWP rules:

You need to notify us before your appointment that you will like to record your assessment by calling our Enquiry Centre on 0808 1788 114.
You will need to provide your own audio-recording equipment. Your recording equipment must be able to produce two identical copies of the recording at the end of the assessment, either on audio cassette or CD. Mobile phones and laptops are not suitable mediums for recording assessments.
You will need to give one copy of the recording to the assessor, at the end of the appointment.
You will need to sign an agreement that sets out what you are and are not allowed to do with the recording.
We will retain a copy of the recording for a maximum of 14 months, at which point it will be destroyed. We do not pass on the recordings to the DWP and they are not used in determining your entitlement or award.
Should you attempt to record the assessment without having contact us first and agreeing to the above guidelines, then your assessment is likely to be stopped and we may return your case to the DWP."

does seem a bit ridiculous....... but then the whole system is.

eta:
http://www.capita-pip.co.uk/en/assessment-process.html
 
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It sounds from this that the only use that can be made of the recordings is if you are able to get a copy of the assessor's report, find it is telling lies, and want to make a complaint to the company that employed the assessor, quoting the recording as evidence for your complaint.
I agree it is ludicrous that the recording cannot be passed to the DWP.

I agree it's a good idea to put a copy of the transcript in your appeal papers with the key points of difference between what the assessor wrote and what you actually said highlighted.

I am really sorry you are having to go through this traumatic appeal process, @Kelly. I hope you get justice.
 
Sly Saint said:
"
Capita state this,

Audio recording

Should you wish, you may use your own equipment to record the face-to-face consultation. This must be undertaken in line with the following DWP rules:

You need to notify us before your appointment that you will like to record your assessment by calling our Enquiry Centre on 0808 1788 114.
You will need to provide your own audio-recording equipment. Your recording equipment must be able to produce two identical copies of the recording at the end of the assessment, either on audio cassette or CD. Mobile phones and laptops are not suitable mediums for recording assessments.
You will need to give one copy of the recording to the assessor, at the end of the appointment.
You will need to sign an agreement that sets out what you are and are not allowed to do with the recording.
We will retain a copy of the recording for a maximum of 14 months, at which point it will be destroyed. We do not pass on the recordings to the DWP and they are not used in determining your entitlement or award.
Should you attempt to record the assessment without having contact us first and agreeing to the above guidelines, then your assessment is likely to be stopped and we may return your case to the DWP."

does seem a bit ridiculous....... but then the whole system is.
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Thanks Sly. Where did this come from? I’ve checked the booklet that came with my appointment letter from IAS, and also looked at their website. I could only find the rules for making the recording.

Also, I would have thought that me wanting the DM to use the recording to verify the accuracy of the report that they used to decide no award is not the same as using it to determine an award.

From telephone calls that I had yesterday, I think the DWP may be taking the stance that they accept the report to be fair and accurate and it is none of their concern if it is not. So from that I will be pursuing a complaint with IAS and insisting on revisions to my report. I know there’s a strong possibility that it won’t go anywhere but I must try (as much as I can within the confines of my limitations). If nothing else, it will provide me with more knowledge to better jump through their hoops the next time.
 
Invisible Woman said:
I know you've got enough on your plate right now @Kelly, but, at some point, I think this is worth raising with your MP.

It looks like they're trying to turn the right to recordings into just another means of spinning our own wheels, while getting nowhere. :banghead:

So, sorry they are making you go through all this. :hug:
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This is usually a good idea. Unfortunately my MP is not interested in helping me. I’ve spent over a year communicating with him with regards to the MAIMES campaign. He wasted a lot of my precious energy giving me the runaround, so I eventually got quite stern and asked him to stop treating me like that and either sign up or tell me why he would not. He pretty much quoted Lord Shaunnessy’s stance as his reasons. My MP is seemingly only interested in taking groups to visit parliament!
 
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