Nasobiotex L. Sakei Probiotic Powder for sinus microbiome - anyone tried it?

One thinkg I never mentioned: I've already been evaluated and scoped by an ENT doc. He told me surgery was not an option and there was nothing he could do for me. My primary are doctor simply prescribed Flonase, which I found essentially worthless.

I've been looking for sinusitis solutions on my own, because my doctors have nothing to help me.
 
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Webdog said:
One think I never mentioned: I've already been evaluated and scoped by an ENT doc. He told me surgery was not an option and there was nothing he could do for me. My primary are doctor simply prescribed Flonase, which I found essentially worthless.

I've been looking for sinusitis solutions on my own, because my doctors have nothing to help me.
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I've been scoped by six ENTs, sent for CT scans by all six ENTs, and was told by the last ENT that I have almost perfect sinuses. No one could tell me why I was getting badly swollen sinuses, face pain, and malaise. It took a foreign trained GP at a walk in clinic to suggest that it was allergies that was causing my issues. And like you, Webdog, all that the ENTs and doctors could recommend over the years was either antibiotics which weren't needed in most cases, or Flonase, which when taken on a regular basis, gave me the headache from hell and mentally turned me into a very negative person. Never again.
 
dannybex said:
Any updates?
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Good timing, Danny! I was just about to post that I received the replacement shipment just before noon today. I'm trying not to get my hopes up in case this doesn't work as nothing else has worked over the past 26 years. But I'll be so disappointed if it doesn't work because I feel like this is my last hope for my sinuses.
 
TigerLilea said:
Good timing, Danny! I was just about to post that I received the replacement shipment just before noon today. I'm trying not to get my hopes up in case this doesn't work as nothing else has worked over the past 26 years. But I'll be so disappointed if it doesn't work because I feel like this is my last hope for my sinuses.
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I would certainly give it some time, and try different methods as @Webdog has done. After 26 years, it'll probably take awhile to start to see any significant improvement, and it's my understanding that it needs to be taken on a regular basis for improvement.

There's also l. plantarum (and I'm sure many others that are beneficial via the gut). But l. plantarum has been shown to be effective against dust-mite related allergies/sinusitis:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1906181/

And also Tinospora cordifolia.

"With TC treatment 100% relief was reported from sneezing in 83% patients, in 69% from nasal discharge, in 61% from nasal obstruction and in 71% from nasal pruritus. In placebo group, there was no relief in 79% from sneezing, in 84.8% from nasal discharge, in 83% from nasal obstruction, and in 88% from nasal pruritus."

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S037887410400474X
 
dannybex said:
I would certainly give it some time, and try different methods as @Webdog has done. After 26 years, it'll probably take awhile to start to see any significant improvement, and it's my understanding that it needs to be taken on a regular basis for improvement.

There's also l. plantarum (and I'm sure many others that are beneficial via the gut). But l. plantarum has been shown to be effective against dust-mite related allergies/sinusitis:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1906181/

And also Tinospora cordifolia.

"With TC treatment 100% relief was reported from sneezing in 83% patients, in 69% from nasal discharge, in 61% from nasal obstruction and in 71% from nasal pruritus. In placebo group, there was no relief in 79% from sneezing, in 84.8% from nasal discharge, in 83% from nasal obstruction, and in 88% from nasal pruritus."

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S037887410400474X
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Someone else told me today that I have to be patient and give it time. I think that being into my third month of having Chronic Sinusitis is really starting to get me down.

I'll look into the l. plantarum as I'd like to use additional probiotics during my good times to see if that can help to reduce the number of sinus issues I get throughout the year. I've also cut out caffeine as I'm wondering if that is one of my triggers.
 
NEVER pour a 1/4 cup of water and 1/8 tsp of Bactoferm through your sinuses with your neti-pot. Holy cow, it was like pouring acid through my sinuses. It HURT. Even my eyeballs felt it. Lesson learned.

I am very stuffed up this morning and my sinuses feel very swollen. I don't know if it is the Bactoferm or am I coming down with a cold?? I guess time will tell.
 
Webdog said:
However, a number of products have been beneficial short term (zinc comes to mind), only to stop working after a couple weeks. I need something long term.
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Over on the Lacto-Bacto website they don't recommend using l. sakei long term. Just long enough to get rid of the sinusitis and then stop. After that only use when you feel yourself coming down with sinusitis.
 
TigerLilea said:
Over on the Lacto-Bacto website they don't recommend using l. sakei long term. Just long enough to get rid of the sinusitis and then stop. After that only use when you feel yourself coming down with sinusitis.
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Good advice. Only the "get rid of the sinusitis" seems to be the tricky part.

I've seen a lot of improvement and this is definitely the best product I've tried. But I don't think L. Sakei will ever cure my chronic sinusitis.
 
Webdog said:
Good advice. Only the "get rid of the sinusitis" seems to be the tricky part.

I've seen a lot of improvement and this is definitely the best product I've tried. But I don't think L. Sakei will ever cure my chronic sinusitis.
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@Webdog Have you ever been able to figure out what triggers your sinusitis in the first place? Mine always happens around this time of the year and I'm still trying to figure out what causes it.
 
TigerLilea said:
@Webdog Have you ever been able to figure out what triggers your sinusitis in the first place? Mine always happens around this time of the year and I'm still trying to figure out what causes it.
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No, and can't get my doctor interested in figuring it out. It's year round, not seasonal for me.

When I've been prescribed antibiotics (doxycycline/clarithromycin for other issues), it hasn't seemed to improved my sinusitis.

Personally I suspect it's bacterial, and a lot of my history would be consistent with a chronic strep infection (PANDAS). Plus I've had a number of positive Strep A tests throughout my adult life. It's just a theory, however, and there could be other explanations.
 
Webdog said:
Personally I suspect it's bacterial, and a lot of my history would be consistent with a chronic strep infection (PANDAS). Plus I've had a number of positive Strep A tests throughout my adult life. It's just a theory, however, and there could be other explanations.
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My experience with bacterial sinusitis is that I sleep around the clock when I have it. This is how I know when I need to be on antibiotics. I recently read something written by an ENT at one of the big hospitals in the US (can't recall which one) who said that the most important question a doctor can ask their patient who thinks that they have a sinus infection is 'how much are you sleeping?' He said that is the best indicator for whether or not to prescribe antibiotics.
 
Webdog said:
Unpleasant side effects.
  • As regions of my nasal passage and sinuses became exposed, I experienced some mild pain that decreased with time. Although I couldn't see what was happening, it felt like a sore exposed to air that gradually healed over.
  • Sinus pressure in different regions when my sinus were draining. This could be mildly painful. I could feel and hear fluid moving around. It often had a "crackly" sound.
  • Sore throat for the first 3 weeks. This seemed to be due to sinus drainage. As the drainage decreased, so did the sore throats.
  • Excessive sleep. Almost as soon as I started the nasal probiotic, I started sleeping 11 hours a night instead of my usual 8. Currently I'm sleeping about 10 hours. I don't feel like I'm oversleeping, and unsure why my body needs this much sleep.
  • More fatigue. In addition to being sleepier, I've generally felt more fatigued and housebound. Hopefully this will improve.
  • Not every day will be an improvement. The treatment has been a "2 steps forward 1 step back" kind of thing. While not every day is better, every week has been.
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Reading people's comments over on Lacto-Bacto it seems that most people who were helped noticed a huge difference within 12 to 72 hours. I feel worse now than when I started. Maybe having ME makes a difference??

I rinsed my sinuses this morning with saline as they burned from the past three days of using the Bactoferm in the neti pot. I kept waking up last night in part because my headache was so much worse. I'm only going to do the swab today and forget about using the neti pot and see how that goes.

I'm also much more congested right now, but I don't know if that is due to the Bacto or if I have a virus that is going around. All I know is the past few days I feel like hell. :emoji_disappointed:
 
TigerLilea said:
Reading people's comments over on Lacto-Bacto it seems that most people who were helped noticed a huge difference within 12 to 72 hours. I feel worse now than when I started. Maybe having ME makes a difference??

I rinsed my sinuses this morning with saline as they burned from the past three days of using the Bactoferm in the neti pot. I kept waking up last night in part because my headache was so much worse. I'm only going to do the swab today and forget about using the neti pot and see how that goes.

I'm also much more congested right now, but I don't know if that is due to the Bacto or if I have a virus that is going around. All I know is the past few days I feel like hell. :emoji_disappointed:
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Sorry you feel so badly.

I'm so very mixed. I noticed a huge difference quite quickly, within 24 hours. My breathing continues to be better even and I sleep better at night.

But ironically, I'm more fatigued and bedbound than usual. My brain has an extra layer of fog on it. I have an even briefer window of functioning every day.

My treatment goals are always to 1) improve quality of life and 2) improve functioning. Quality of life has improved with the decreased sinusitis and better sleep, but functioning has actually slightly deteriorated.

I truly expected that if my sinusitis improved, I would feel less fatigued and housebound. But that hasn't panned out (yet).
 
TigerLilea said:
only going to do the swab today and forget about using the neti pot and see how that goes.
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@TigerLilea You reminded me of my experience with the neti pot. I bought a neti pot in my severe years for my chronic sinusitis. I had to stop using it. I felt so much worse, increased dizziness, heavy head. It felt like the walls of my sinus held on to some of the water making me feel even worse than before.
 
@Webdog, fwiw, my experience is similar when I'm doing biofilm busting/microbiome rearranging.

The toxins released from dying/threatened bacteria can be overwhelming. Some of them (particularly yeast)
produce ethanol/acetaldehyde--this makes me incredibly stupid, exhausted and kind of drunk feeling (not in a fun way.)
It can be severe and alarming.

I would consider backing off on the amount and/or frequency if these symptoms are too much. It's possible to still reorganize the bacterial balance in your sinus by pulsing on a less vigorous schedule, and avoid overwhelming your system with these bacterial by-products.
 
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