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Brian Hughes - If you spend 20 years gaslighting your patients, perhaps you should think twice before accusing *them* of trolling *you*

Discussion in 'PsychoSocial ME/CFS News' started by Cheshire, Mar 21, 2019.

  1. Cheshire

    Cheshire Moderator Staff Member

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    https://notthesciencebit.net/2019/0...f-trolling-you/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
     
  2. andypants

    andypants Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    key point
     
  3. chrisb

    chrisb Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Every time I see that photo I admire the skill of the person who photoshopped that flashing mac on to SW. There could be no other explanation, but the skill is extraordinary.
     
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  4. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    Thank you @Brian Hughes, you've cheered me up enormously after a pretty bad week in the ME world. :)
     
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  5. Brian Hughes

    Brian Hughes Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Glad to be of service! :nerd:
     
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  6. chrisb

    chrisb Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yes, thanks Brian. It's always a relief to be reminded that there are sane voices out there. I should have remarked on that in my earlier post, but that photo does divert the attention.
     
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  7. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

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    May I commend you @Brian Hughes for your extraordinary bravery in interacting with us here. In all of the interwebs, you will never find a more wretched hive of scum, villainy and anti-science trolls than S4ME. To actually log in here, using your real name as well, shows such daring and blatant disregard for your own personal well being - the world has probably never seen the like. ;)

    Also, nice blog, thanks :)
     
  8. fivetowns

    fivetowns Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    Good article but I'm a little concerned about the use of 'malingering' with respect to the BPS model of CFS/ME. ''Malingering' refers to the fabrication of an illness and though the BPS lot have accused us of mistaking normal bodily sensations for the signs of disease they have never (to my knowledge) implied CFS/ME patients deliberately fake symptoms.
     
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  9. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Ditto thank you @Brian Hughes.

    "Malingering and Illness Deception"; a troubling conference with very revealing terminology and attitudes. It must be desperately grim for PS workers to ugh, have to deal with people they despise.
     
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  10. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Last time I said something like that I was ticked off by Kina!
     
  11. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    But that would fall outside an effective doublespeak. The doublespeak of biopsychosocial is intended to sound impressive and knowledgeable to patients while only meaning something else to doctors. To tell patients that they are malingering wouldn't work so well. And who knows what they actually think, since they change their story to fit every situation.
     
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  12. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I understand pwME ("cfs") have been called the undeserving sick by the PS'ers. I can't specifically recall the use of the term
    "malingering"; it may have been used - to find out might take a bit of searching. Maybe someone else knows?
     
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  13. Arnie Pye

    Arnie Pye Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The title of the photograph in the article was "Malingering and Illness Deception Meeting". It wasn't Brian's choice to use the word "Malingering", it was the choice of word of the people who set up the conference.
     
  14. Cinders66

    Cinders66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    It’s great to see this article by a psychologist. My only concern is that it sort of misrepresents the BPS model as them claiming our illness is psychogenic or a figment if the imagination which they don’t and someone like wessely can then dismiss everything valid, the 99% because of that
    . I understand caricaturing them is useful for highlighting the ridiculousness and to simplify things but These psychiatrists invented a “third way’ illness model for CFS and other unexplained illness where we weren’t seriously sick but were genuinely debilitated because of a “complex interplay” of a physical trigger, an unhelpful behavioural response , inactivity and the bodily systems (circadian rhythm, increased sensitivity to normal signals etc) going Wrong, or something like that. This model was supposedly proven by the success of rehabilitation treatment based on this model rather than by research and is another reason i think why The treatments must for them remain valid.

    The problem for me was the assumption there wasn’t serious anything biological that needed finding and how their theories Also encouraged other drs to think they way, or I assume that’s why no one seemed to think we needed a biomedical research effort.
     
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  15. Cheshire

    Cheshire Moderator Staff Member

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    To be precise, MS said that's how doctors view us. (but IMO, it's a way to say it without saying it. "Some say..." should always be followed by a firm condemnation, if not it remains ambiguous.)
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2019
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  16. Arnie Pye

    Arnie Pye Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    @Cinders66 Did you notice the title of the photograph (above the picture) in Brian's article? That title has obviously been there a long time, I don't think it was something Brian added.
     
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  17. Eagles

    Eagles Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    For further details of the 2001 conference held in Oxford entitled “Malingering and Illness Deception Meeting”, see page 2 of “ME: who is attacking whom?” by Eileen Marshall and Margaret Williams - http://www.margaretwilliams.me/2005/me-who-is-attacking-whom.pdf
     
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  18. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  19. Cinders66

    Cinders66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yes but I didn’t refer to that picture specifically and there were several descriptions in the article as the BPS drs basically thinking it all in the mind, when wessely has been on media very cleverly stressing that they don’t think it’s in the mind. Regarding the picture, has anyone dug deeper into context, was it CFS related? I think in the darker early days they were more harsh in their views. If anyone has seen old newspaper articles pictures, not online now, I think that they were even more offensive then.
     
  20. Arnie Pye

    Arnie Pye Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.729.2487&rep=rep1&type=pdf

    Do a search for "CFS" in the above link, which appears to be a PDF of a book published in 2003. Wessely is mentioned in the list of contributors (pages 11 - 12), and so is Sharpe. So is Mansel Aylward. I'm sure there must be other (in)famous names that I'm not familiar with.
     
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