RNZCGP GoodFellow Unit MedCases CPD Sept 2023: Chronic fatigue syndrome/myalgic encephalomyelitis

Wow! I think your letter is terrific.

As I was reading through I found a few more typos and a couple of grammar things which you may or may not think are important but I highlighted them in red in anyway.

I'm in awe of S4ME and the people who put in so much effort and I am sincerely grateful.
 

Attachments

Hutan, I think your letter is great. I am very new to the forum and have not yet got my head around how to navigate it and I may have made an earlier reply that says nothing! What irks me about all this is how the “potential harms” term is minimising and it will be good to see a shift towards being more explicit about what the harms look like at an individual basis rather than alluded to in papers. Also, of no usefulness at all really other than to illicit a “yeah, that would be right”, but I was looking at Bruce Arroll’s inactive Twitter account and Phil Parker is one of his few followers.
 
Thank you very much Deanne and welcome to the forum. For new members, it can take a while for your first posts to show on the forum. Later on, they will show up immediately.

Deanne NZ said:
but I was looking at Bruce Arroll’s inactive Twitter account and Phil Parker is one of his few followers.
Click to expand...
That's funny. I guess it would be worse if Arroll was a follower of Parker.
 
Thanks very much @oldtimer. Here's the latest version of the letter, I have removed references to Cathy Stephenson who, while having produced some good materials, may not want to be held up as the go-to expert for ME/CFS. If anyone else sees issues, and I'm sure there are more, maybe send me a DM? I'm going to read over it again tomorrow and then see if I can send it off.

(see post #50 for the final version of the letter)
 
Last edited:
Hutan said:
Thanks very much @oldtimer. Here's the latest version of the letter, I have removed references to Cathy Stephenson who, while having produced some good materials, may not want to be held up as the go-to expert for ME/CFS. If anyone else sees issues, and I'm sure there are more, maybe send me a DM? I'm going to read over it again tomorrow and then see if I can send it off.
Click to expand...
Brilliant letter @Hutan. I hope it has not cost too many spoons and you both are able to rest up for a while , and it properly makes its mark .

Thank you
 
@Hutan brilliant letter which leads the reader thru the issues. Thanks so much for preparing it and also asking questions around existing strategy and whether Cathy should be mentioned.
I have raised with the GP education team at M.E. Awareness NZ. Yes please send on your own account - it will be great to have your voice and information added to efforts.
Agree that Cathy should not be mentioned. She is very clear that she is not an expert on ME/CFS, is more of a conduit for patient-experts and reputable international guidance, and RNZCGP are very aware of her efforts in this area already.
It might be good to forward a copy to ANZMES (and M.E. Awareness NZ) so they are aware of all advocacy efforts should a meeting take place with RNZCGP and others.
 
I sent a version of the letter off today, attached here. I'll delete earlier versions on the thread to prevent confusion.

I've also sent it to people involved in the health system in my region that I know, including people linked with HealthPathways, so hopefully that will be one step towards keeping/getting these therapies out of clinical pathways generally.

The link I had to old NLP material by Arroll that worked a couple of days ago didn't work today, but there are other documents by Arroll out there, so I found another one.

I had my son read through the letter with fresh eyes. He commented that he was convinced from the link to the Norwegian website with testimonies. That website is a tremendous resource.
 

Attachments

RoseE said:
Bruce Arroll has a very high reputation within medical circles in NZ.
Click to expand...
Just noting this
Judges wowed by long-serving professor’s qualities of ingenuity, humility, generosity
https://www.auckland.ac.nz/en/news/2021/06/29/judges-wowed-by-long-serving-professor.html
Professor Bruce Arroll, GP and general practice founder, academic, family man, innovator, proponent of Te Tiriti o Waitangi principles and award winner, has plenty more gas in the tank.
Click to expand...
A 41-year career pursuing excellence and generously sharing his knowledge and good humour brought academic GP Bruce Arroll the top award in the 2021 New Zealand Primary Healthcare Awards | He Tohu Mauri Ora.

The magic factor is his humility that clearly underpins all of his endeavours. At the awards gala ceremony at Auckland’s Cordis Hotel on 15 May, Professor Arroll received the ACC Supreme Award after earlier picking up the Green Cross Health Outstanding Contribution to Health Award.
Click to expand...
Professor Arroll says he enjoys his work enormously, as a GP, and as professor of general practice and primary health care at the University of Auckland, and director of the Goodfellow Unit.

“It doesn’t feel like I’m working,” he says.
Click to expand...

This feels very much from the UK BPS playbook - very much 'establishment', effort spent pursuing accolades.
 
Last edited:
Hutan said:
I sent a version of the letter off today, attached here. I'll delete earlier versions on the thread to prevent confusion.

I've also sent it to people involved in the health system in my region that I know, including people linked with HealthPathways, so hopefully that will be one step towards keeping/getting these therapies out of clinical pathways generally.

The link I had to old NLP material by Arroll that worked a couple of days ago didn't work today, but there are other documents by Arroll out there, so I found another one.

I had my son read through the letter with fresh eyes. He commented that he was convinced from the link to the Norwegian website with testimonies. That website is a tremendous resource.
Click to expand...
I am curious to know if you have had any response to your letter yet.
 
I still have not had a response to my letter, despite multiple following ups including phoning the office a couple of times.

I see that the Goodfellow Unit and specifically Bruce Arroll and Jenny Oliver ran a session on the Lightning Process in March 2024:
https://www.goodfellowunit.org/symposium/programme/session/case-study-lightning-processr-long-covid
Edit: saved on the wayback machine

Case study: Lightning Process® for Long Covid
Speaker
Bruce Arroll Jenny Oliver
Session Date:
Sunday, March 24, 2024 - 11:05
This session is a repeat of the 9.35 clinic.

Bruce and Jenny will present a 53-year-old woman Amber Older, who will be present at the conference.

Amber was developing Long Covid and was not able to do a full week of work. She was very sensitive to light and noise and could not sleep without medication. Long Covid is now seen as a mind-body condition that can get better with non-drug therapies such as CBT.

Amber did the lightning process for her Long Covid. She started improving from day one and a few weeks later was back to full functioning.
Click to expand...
You’ll learn...
  • Exactly what LP is, why does it work so quickly, and how is it used? (Backed by a RCT for Chronic Fatigue in adolescents).
  • Data from the first patients to get the LP for Long Covid (there are no RCTs yet).
  • A mention of the CBT trial that was effective for Long Covid.
  • A useful, easy to learn process/technique to make change in any moment.
  • How to reset and regulate your nervous system to stay consistently in the parasympathetic nervous system.
  • How to transition out of flight, flight, freeze.
  • How to replace limiting beliefs with more useful ones.
  • Key language patterns to transform thinking and behaviour. Yes, words really do matter.
  • How to stay calm in specific areas of life – sleep, being around others, in work situations, recreation.
  • How to put all this into real life: Fast, sustainable change.
All questions answered.
Click to expand...

The Symposium was sponsored by the University of Auckland, Mercy Ascot, the Royal NZ College of GPs, Royal NZ College of Urgent Care

Items promoting the Lightning Process and similar products in New Zealand totally swamp search engine results to a 'Lightning Process Long Covid' search.
It feels as though we are losing this battle.
 
Last edited:
How are people supposed to trust the credibility of medicine when they swallow stuff like this? Especially this thoroughly, it's basically an advertisement for it, full endorsement rarely just quotes straight from the marketing brochure this much because it sounds too forced and unnatural, people recoil from it. This could be followed by a seminar on astrological healing and it would feel like a natural thing.
 
Hutan said:
I still have not had a response to my letter, despite multiple following ups including phoning the office a couple of times.

I see that the Goodfellow Unit and specifically Bruce Arroll and Jenny Oliver ran a session on the Lightning Process in March 2024:
https://www.goodfellowunit.org/symposium/programme/session/case-study-lightning-processr-long-covid



The Symposium was sponsored by the University of Auckland, Mercy Ascot, the Royal NZ College of GPs, Royal NZ College of Urgent Care

Items promoting the Lightning Process and similar products in New Zealand totally swamp search engine results to a 'Lightning Process Long Covid' search.
It feels as though we are losing this battle.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the effort. The RACGP commissioned this guy and his daughter to review current evidence base for cbt and graded exercise for cfs in 2013. The review is still on their website but I doubt they will stoop so low to tout The lightening Process.
https://www.racgp.org.au/afp/2013/april/chronic-fatigue-syndrome
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom