1. Guest, the 'News in Brief' for the week beginning 12th October 2020 is here.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Welcome! To read the Core Purpose and Values of our forum, click here.
    Dismiss Notice

Melatonin

Discussion in 'Sleep Disturbance' started by Maria1, Nov 5, 2017.

  1. Woolie

    Woolie Committee member

    Messages:
    2,474
    Likes Received:
    15,886
    @NelliePledge, this is a digression, but have you tried Sominex (which is phenergen, the antihistamine)? I have found it very effective. You can get it over the counter in the UK. My other half is over there at the moment, and always brings me back some. I'd start with a half tablet. A full one can leave you feeling dopey the next morning.

    I have also tried replacing amitriptyline with nortriptyline, and found the nortrip to be less effective than the ami for sleep. In general the tricyclics seem to be rather ineffective sleep aids, and being psychotropic drugs, I'm not sure they're worth the risk just for the tiny sleep benefit. I do worry about doctors' eagerness to ply us with psychotropic drugs - I don't think its because they work all that well for sleep. I think its because deep down, they think we are messed in the head and that's why we can't sleep.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2017
  2. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    6,302
    Likes Received:
    39,143
    Location:
    UK West Midlands
    Thanks @Woolie I will pick some up next time I'm in the pharmacy. I remember having anti histamine when I had chickenpox @28 and that definitely knocked me out
     
  3. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,395
    Likes Received:
    129,569
    Location:
    UK
    @Woolie, I'm a bit puzzled by this. I've just looked up Sominex on Boots the Chemist online store and it describes it as a herbal sleep remedy containing hops, valerian and passion flower, which is a very well known herbal sleep remedy. (also found in other brands such as Kalms, which I use occasionally).

    Phenergan is listed as an antihistamine, described thus:

    ''Phenergan Tablets 25mg is an all-rounder allergy tablet that can be used for hayfever, improved sleep, pet allergies, nausea while travelling, and nettle rashes. It contains 25mg of the active ingredient, Promethazine Hydrochloride.''

    I wonder which one you mean?

    EDIT TO ADD: @Woolie has clarified, and I've re-checked. There are two different products, Sominex Herbal and Sominex.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2017
  4. Woolie

    Woolie Committee member

    Messages:
    2,474
    Likes Received:
    15,886
    @Trish, there must be another herbal thing that uses the same name. The one I'm talking about looks like this:
    [​IMG]
    You can see it has the name of the drug right there on the pack: Promethazine Hydrochloride (aka Phenergan). You buy it over the counter at Boots or Superdrug, or in lots of UK based online stores. You are only allowed to buy 16 at a time, and I think you need to give your name.
     
    Invisible Woman, Inara and Maria1 like this.
  5. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,395
    Likes Received:
    129,569
    Location:
    UK
    You're right, @Woolie, sorry for the confusion. Apparently the herbal one I found on the Boots site is called 'Sominex Herbal'.

    Looks like a good warning to read the label properly. If you're sending someone to the chemist to buy Sominex, make sure they know not to pick up a pack of Sominex Herbal! Sorry for the confusion. I'll amend my earlier post.
     
  6. Woolie

    Woolie Committee member

    Messages:
    2,474
    Likes Received:
    15,886
    Yes, it is on public view. Its not in the "members only " section of the forum. So yea, might be an idea to delete anything you're not happy with.

    Sad to see your doggie avatar go. :(
     
    Invisible Woman and Hutan like this.
  7. Maria1

    Maria1 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    156
    Likes Received:
    1,343
    Location:
    North England
    @Woolie Thank you so much!

    Apologies to all as this was a really interesting and valuable thread but I hadn’t considered it might be viewed or accessible just from a google search.

    Going to delete some posts/ might take me some time as I’m crap at this sort of stuff!!
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2017
  8. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,450
    Likes Received:
    8,846
    Melatonin switched me from a delayed sleep cycle to a completely switched around sleep cycle.

    Resetting the sleep cycle to be at night could indirectly improve sleep quality. Unfortunately, it did the opposite for me.
     
    Invisible Woman, Maria1 and Trish like this.
  9. Sbag

    Sbag Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    277
    Likes Received:
    2,028
    the slow release ones do keep you asleep through the night - i use them for jet lag and they work wonders
     
  10. Sbag

    Sbag Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    277
    Likes Received:
    2,028
    I get it from a website in the US and also if I ever go over there. I get terrible zombie hangover on normal sleeping pills including antihistamines. The melatonin can sometimes have a slight hangover for me at the higher doses but a couple of coffees gets rid of it, whereas they dont shift the other sleeping pill effects. I need to do another order soon and am also in your area so if you want I can send you the link I use or I can order some for you and send on.
     
    Inara and Maria1 like this.
  11. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    6,302
    Likes Received:
    39,143
    Location:
    UK West Midlands
    Thanks for the offer but I've got a friend bringing some back from her holiday in the USA.
     
    Sbag likes this.
  12. Inara

    Inara Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,714
    Likes Received:
    11,083
    You get Melatonin e.g. from Biovea, too. It should ship to UK. It was my "last option" if anything should fail. But I go better with the "retard pills".

    @mods:
    If I'm not allowed to say that, please delete my post.
     
  13. cyclamen

    cyclamen Established Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    250
    Some patients I know take or took Agomelatin (Valdoxan) which is a relativ to Melatonin, but has some antagonistic properties on the 5HT2C-receptors.
    I myself stick to Melatonin, the non slow release type. But has anyone else experience with both, Agomelatin and Melatonin?
     
  14. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    5,148
    Likes Received:
    42,752
    Location:
    UK
    Some foods naturally contain melatonin and are therefore great to have at an evening meal or as a light night time snack:

    • Bananas
    • Morello cherries
    • Porridge oats
    • Sweet corn
    • Rice
    • Ginger
    • Barley
    • Tomatoes
    • Radishes
    • Red wine
    Foods that contain tryptophan can also be eaten in the evening as these help induce production of serotonin, which is required to make melatonin:

    • Dairy products (avoid cheese though)
    • Soy
    • Nuts
    • Seafood
    • Turkey and chicken
    • Whole grains
    • Beans and pulses
    • Rice
    • Eggs
    • Sesame seeds
    • Sunflower seeds
    Some micronutrients are also important in the production of melatonin, including:

    • Vitamin B-6 (Pyridoxal-5-Phosphate)
    • Zinc
    • Magnesium
    • Folic acid

      Don't think I'd go for the Red Wine (can't drink alcohol anymore), but I do have a few bites on a banana when I can't get to sleep.
     
  15. Dial It In

    Dial It In Established Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    89
    Location:
    Australia
    Melatonin was very effective for me when I had mild CFS. Sleepy within 30 minutes.

    Once my CFS became moderate (often housebound) it was useless.
     
  16. Arnie Pye

    Arnie Pye Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    3,189
    Likes Received:
    17,354
    Location:
    UK
    A research paper investigating melatonin use in older people (age 50+), including the subject of the most effective dosage to take, and some consequences of taking too much :

    Melatonin Treatment for Age-Related Insomnia

    Link : http://web.mit.edu/dick/www/pdf/975.pdf

    (Bolding and additional spacing mine)

    I was completely unaware of the connection between melatonin and hypothermia. As someone who struggles to stay warm in bed for most of the year this is info I definitely need to know!

    I haven't read much of the paper because the text is printed with little spacing and is far too dense for me to cope with, but I thought someone might be interested.
     
  17. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    3,309
    Likes Received:
    16,117
    Thats very interesting, i did not know higher doses caused residual effects, though i did know the sleep improvement does not extend above 1mg (a dose they didn't test unfortunately).
     
    Arnie Pye and Wonko like this.

Share This Page