Lightning Process - discussion thread

The ‘Lightning Process’ (LP), an effective therapy for ME?

"Does LP work?

Some think it does, particularly in Norway, it seems.

Proponents of the ‘LP’ in Norway claim that 90% of all ME patients get better after trying it. However, such claims seem to be more than questionable.

  • In the Norwegian ME association’s user survey from 2012 with 1,096 participants, 164 ME patients stated that they had tried LP. 21% of these patients experienced improvement or great improvement and 48% got worse or much worse.
  • In Norway’s National Research Center in Complementary and Alternative Medicine, NAFKAM’s survey from 2015 amongst 76 patients 8 had a positive effect and 5 got worse or much worse.
  • A survey by the Norwegian research foundation, published in the journal Psykologisk, with 660 participants, showed that 62 patients had tried LP, and 5 were very or fairly satisfied with the results.
Such figures seem to reflect the natural history of the condition and may be totally unrelated to LP."

https://edzardernst.com/2023/03/the-lightning-process-lp-an-effective-therapy-for-me/

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follow up article:
ME/CFS: Yes, the ‘Lightning Process’ is nonsense, but is there any other so-called alternative medicine worth trying?

Sure, the LP is dangerous nonsense, but this begs the question of whether so-called alternative medicine (SCAM) has anything to offer for patients suffering from ME/CFS. If the LP story tells us anything, then it must be this: we should not trust single trials, particularly if they seem dodgy. In other words, we should look at systematic reviews that synthesize ALL clinical trials and evaluate them critically.

To locate this type of evidence I conducted several Medline searches and found several recent systematic reviews that address the issue:
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https://edzardernst.com/2023/03/me-...-so-called-alternative-medicine-worth-trying/
 
I think Edzard is dead wrong here:

Sure, the LP is dangerous nonsense, but this begs the question of whether so-called alternative medicine (SCAM) has anything to offer for patients suffering from ME/CFS. If the LP story tells us anything, then it must be this: we should not trust single trials, particularly if they seem dodgy. In other words, we should look at systematic reviews that synthesize ALL clinical trials and evaluate them critically.

One good trial is plenty. Never in the history of trials of major drugs in RA has a clearly positive trial been shown to be a mistake. If you need more than one trial you haven't got a good enough trial, so forget it. Systematic reviews are by and large completely irrelevant to clinical practice except where people are quibbling at the margins about risk/benefit comparisons. Like whether oral contraceptives are too risky, or anti-inflammatory drugs.
 
found this org on Phil Parkers facebook

https://www.happyconfidentkids.org.uk/

"Happy Confident Kids

  • We highly recommend this course at Happy Confident Kids
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https://www.facebook.com/philparker.author/

so LP is being used on kids, in schools?
 
Phil Parker explains 'duing'

Introducing a New Verb for Change: Dû
Although I created the new verb, Dû, in 1999, as part of developing the Lightning Process (LP), I realised recently that I’ve yet to write about it in detail for use by those working in NLP. I hope this article fills that gap. For context, the LP is a research-based programme which has been successful in helping many people recover from chronic health conditions. It is based on NLP but has elements drawn from other disciplines combined with some new concepts. As a result, a thorough knowledge of NLP is essential to becoming an LP Practitioner, but additional training is also required. Dû, however, can be adopted by anyone.
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https://www.philparker.org/introducing-a-new-verb-for-change/

 
Oh "Dû". I remember when Phil Parker made a whole thing writing about touring Normandy on his motorbike looking for a new word. And he found one! He came home with "Dû".

Some wag with ME quipped "Pretentious? Philippe?".
 

Linkedin

Laura Dumbleton-Jones
Director Happy Confident Kids Ltd
United Kingdom
Sep 2018 - Present 4 years 11 months



Education:



    • Phil Parker Training Institute
      Masters Neurolinguistics
      2016 - Present
    • Staff Training Solutions
      Master's degree Train the Trainer Excellent
      2022 - 2022
https://uk.linkedin.com/in/laura-dumbleton-jones-090043185





So, NLP and language - People who've done higher levels of NLP training are called 'NLP Masters'. they've done 'NLP Master' courses, not MA or Msc Degrees. Is LDJ doing a degree in Neurolinguistics? Or does the Master's refer to more NLP courses?





Companies House. Happy Confident Kids Ltd
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/14789435/officers

The Companies House info that Happy Confident Kids LTD was Incorporated on the 10 April 2023, and that LDJ was Appointed Director on 10 April 2023 - doesn't tally with LDJ's Linkedin info that states she's been a Director of Happy Confident Kids LTD since September 2018 - Present. For 4 years 11 months.

 
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Lou B Lou said:
    • Staff Training Solutions
      Master's degree Train the Trainer Excellent
      2022 - 2022
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This is highly deceitful, and if it is being used in the UK to market her services, I wonder if it might be contravening the Trade Descriptions act (or whatever the modern equivalent might be).

What I see on LinkedIn is:

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Masters degree my foot! Two months or so long? Grade excellent?! They just play with words to deceive vulnerable people, which totally epitomises the sort of people they are, and the sort of (dis)service they offer. These sort of people just do not realise how blatant and obvious their cheapskate trickery is. They have no right (possibly no legal right) to call this training a degree.
 
Sly Saint said:
found this org on Phil Parkers facebook

https://www.happyconfidentkids.org.uk/

"Happy Confident Kids

  • We highly recommend this course at Happy Confident Kids
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    1f44c.png
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https://www.facebook.com/philparker.author/

so LP is being used on kids, in schools?
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Looks more like fellow grifters selling the same product:
Happy confident kids said:
Our fun, innovative and engaging methods combine neuro-linguistics (NLP), play-based therapy and coaching, teaching children how to overcome their negative thoughts and behaviours.
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Hoopoe said:
Teaching kids false ideas about how to manage serious illness, or every day doubts and insecurities and uncertainties is not going to be good for their mental health.
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Telling children to lie about their symptoms also puts their physical health at risk.

For children with ME it puts them at risk of over exertion and the associated long term deterioration preventing any effective pacing and symptom management, but also children with other/additional conditions may fail to be diagnosed or treated appropriately.
 
NLP/Lightning Process Trainer telling Employers that she can get Long Covid Sufferers Back to Work, also employees on sickness absence who have other typically tricky issues. That includes ME. Phil Parker's Lightning trainers call ME "an issue" not a disease. Lauren conflates burnout/fatigue with serious medical diseases.

Lauren Stoney's 'Return to Work Health Programme' is sold directly to employers, placing sick employees in the disempowered and dangerous position of potentially being coerced by their employer to take part in a commercial NLP or Lightning Process training/coaching, with the implication that any reluctance by employees about doing this NLP/Lightning coaching will cost the employers money.

Lauren Stoney also invites employers to be part of a early-stage workplace pilot test






Lauren Stoney Life Crafting (she appears to be Brighton based):

'Reduce Sickness Absence


Are you an innovative forward-thinking organisation?

I use evidence-based techniques to get clients with fatigue, chronic pain, anxiety and more recently Long Covid back into health and work.

If you would like to be a part of my early stage workplace pilot tests, this has the potential to significantly reduce sickness absence, and support staff health and wellbeing.

Contact me directly.




'With the psycho-neurological training I provide, chronic issues do not have to be lifelong


Be a part of this innovative, early-stage pilot test to find out how you can:
  • Support staff health and wellbeing and
  • Reduce long-term sickness absence from Long Covid and other typically tricky issues
Please contact me directly:

https://www.laurenstoney.co.uk/long-covid-return-to-work/






Lauren Stoney Life Crafting 'Return to Health Work programme :

'Health and Productivity
Support for your staff

Help staff get their oomph back, and support employee return to work from sickness absence
Health & Productivity Support Packages'


In 2016, after months of increasing symptoms and recurring sick days, I was diagnosed with a lifelong autoimmune condition, and signed off work.

After a month of sick leave (and many more recurring absences prior to that), I was resigned to handing in my notice and giving up on my career.

But then I did the Lightning Process and I turned things around.

I went back to work a week later and rebuilt my career. Now I help others do the same.'



'For businesses of 500+ employees, long term sickness absence costs over £770,000 every year. But according to research, early intervention can reduce the impact of the length of a typical absence by 17%.

What if you could achieve that, and perhaps even more, for your staff? When I was ill, I went from recurring days and eventually a solid month on sickness absence to zero days off attributable to illness.

Ultimately, supporting staff, means big cost savings whilst knowing you’re being an ethical and responsible employer.



  • 4 days are lost on average to each worker due to sickness
  • Employers lose around £570 per employee each year due to sickness related absence
  • For those who take around six weeks’ sickness absence, one in five will stay off work sick and eventually leave paid employment completely
  • Employees struggling with burnout are 50% less likely to discuss how they approach their performance goals with manager'



    Workshops & Coaching Packages
    I run a number of workshops to help staff get their oomph back and support employees returning to work after a period of absence.
    I also partner with a data management company to ensure demonstrable benefit to the company
    All workshops and 1-1 coaching provide brain training tools and techniques, with post course resources to support staff in implementing post workshop.
    A range of services are available from short one hour lunch and learns, to 1-1 coaching and more comprehensive support packages designed to support staff who are struggling with issues affecting health and productivity.
    The below workshops represent some of the core workshops but there are further workshops available

    I run a number of workshops to help staff get their oomph back and support employees returning to work after a period of absence.
    I also partner with a data management company to ensure demonstrable benefit to the company.

    All workshops and 1-1 coaching provide brain training tools and techniques, with post course resources to support staff in implementing post workshop.


  • please enquire directly for more information
https://www.laurenstoney.co.uk/the-lslc-return-to-health-work-programme/
 
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Lauren Stoney's Linkedin Bio:

'Helping passionate individuals bounce back from long covid, fatigue, burnout and anxiety'

Experienced Health & Performance Coach helping you get your oomph back...

I believe in a world where passionate individuals can pursue their dreams, free from burnout and stress-triggered chronic illness. And that's why it's my mission to help driven individuals move from exhaustion, struggle and illness to health, empowerment and success.

You absolutely CAN be the success you want to see in the world whilst thriving in health.

Offering individual coaching, group training and workshops, I work with HR Managers, Coworking Community Managers and individuals.'


Lightning Process Practitioner
Jan 2019 - Present4 years 7 months


https://uk.linkedin.com/in/laurenstoney

 
Lou B Lou said:
Lauren Stoney's Linkedin Bio:

'Helping passionate individuals bounce back from long covid, fatigue, burnout and anxiety'

Experienced Health & Performance Coach helping you get your oomph back...

I believe in a world where passionate individuals can pursue their dreams, free from burnout and stress-triggered chronic illness. And that's why it's my mission to help driven individuals move from exhaustion, struggle and illness to health, empowerment and success.

You absolutely CAN be the success you want to see in the world whilst thriving in health.

Offering individual coaching, group training and workshops, I work with HR Managers, Coworking Community Managers and individuals.'


Lightning Process Practitioner
Jan 2019 - Present4 years 7 months


https://uk.linkedin.com/in/laurenstoney
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The wording absolutely loaded to mean that if you don't bounce back, then it's all your fault, not mine.
 
Lou B Lou said:
Lauren Stoney's 'Return to Work Health Programme' is sold directly to employers, placing sick employees in the disempowered and dangerous position of potentially being coerced by their employer to take part in a commercial NLP or Lightning Process training/coaching, with the implication that any reluctance by employees about doing this NLP/Lightning coaching will cost the employers money.
Click to expand...
That's as evil as the devil. Potentially costing employees huge amounts of disability insurance benefits when they're too ill to work.
 
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