1. Read all the 'News In Brief' from w/c 21st May. Click to read.
    Dismiss Notice

Hodges: Physiological measures in participants with chronic fatigue syndrome, multiple sclerosis and healthy controls following repeated exercise

Discussion in 'BioMedical ME/CFS Research' started by Sasha, Nov 8, 2017.

  1. Sasha

    Sasha Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,335
    Likes Received:
    10,430
    Location:
    UK
    Published back in August but I didn't notice it then.

    Small pilot study.

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/wol1/doi/10.1111/cpf.12460/abstract
     
    ahimsa, Joel, Esther12 and 18 others like this.
  2. Adrian

    Adrian Administrator

    Messages:
    1,995
    Likes Received:
    9,987
    Location:
    UK
    I'm assuming this is an independent replication of the two day exercise testing.
     
    Esther12, Wonko, Barry and 2 others like this.
  3. Sasha

    Sasha Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,335
    Likes Received:
    10,430
    Location:
    UK
    The authors are all in New Zealand, so yes, it seems so.
     
    Esther12, Wonko, Barry and 2 others like this.
  4. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,253
    Likes Received:
    4,668
    This study was followed by a CPET study with 48 and 72 hours between CPET measurements.

    @Daisybell and I participated in this second study. The results have not yet been published, as far as I know.
     
    Esther12, Inara, Wonko and 18 others like this.
  5. Woolie

    Woolie Committee member

    Messages:
    1,568
    Likes Received:
    9,489
    So glad to see NZ associated with something other than Keith Petrie and Rona Moss Morris.
     
    Esther12, Jan, Daisybell and 10 others like this.
  6. Simon M

    Simon M Established Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    1,651
    Location:
    UK
    Well, certainly a very worthwhile approach but a pilot and only 7 mecfs and 7 MS patients makes the conclusion somewhat overblown
    I’m willing to bet they didn’t correct statistics appropriately for all the many comparisons, which might do for the stat sig results.

    Above all, we know that results from previous exercise studies on mecfs patients are all over the place, and until researchers can identify and achieve consistent results for mecfs patients (perhaps by sub groups), it’s likely to be impossible to have a meaningful comparison with other conditions.
     
    Esther12, Wonko, Woolie and 6 others like this.
  7. Mithriel

    Mithriel Established Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    414
    Is the point not that ME patients, even if not all of them, do not have the same results on the second day? It is so taken for granted that everyone has the same results if this test is repeated that patients with heart disease or lung problems are only given the one test.

    While it cannot be proved that no MS patient or heart patient will not have different results, a single ME patient who does deteriorate shows this is something that desperately needs to be studied.
     
    Inara, Wonko, Woolie and 1 other person like this.
  8. Barry

    Barry Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,219
    Likes Received:
    14,201
    It does state it's a pilot study, and suggests rather than claims. A bigger study would be good of course.
     
    Jan, Mij, Hutan and 2 others like this.
  9. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    477
    Likes Received:
    5,600
  10. Wonko

    Wonko Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,198
    Likes Received:
    9,134
    Location:
    UK
    Whilst I can see the value in being able to demonstrate a marked dropoff in performance for pwME I worry, given the sort of linguistic trickery we have seen in the UK, that the use of word "repeated" may be misused.

    That we will end up with what bears striking similarity to the old witchfinder trials.

    Just keep testing them - if they get better they're okay, if they die they were clearly ill, oops - but at least we don't have to treat them, or put up with them in our nice cosy society. Win win, from one point of view.

    Probably just me
     
    Woolie, Zombie Lurker, Andy and 3 others like this.
  11. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    828
    Likes Received:
    6,204
    Location:
    UK
    @ Wonko Not something that had occured to me, but I wouldn't be surprised!
     
    Andy, Inara and Wonko like this.
  12. Barry

    Barry Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,219
    Likes Received:
    14,201
    I don't see this as necesarily just about an in-service diagnostics strategy. Initially it is about paving the way for changing people's attitudes, helping them see there really are biological differentiators that distinguish ME from other conditions. Maybe then motivating further research to develop more viable in-service diagnostics. This line of research, especially if replicated on a larger scale, could be a big nail in the BPS coffin. Now where did I put that hammer.
     
    Woolie, Jan, Trish and 4 others like this.

Share This Page