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Work and Pensions Select Comittee (UK) findings re: failures of PIP and ESA assessments

Discussion in 'Health News and Research unrelated to ME/CFS' started by Skycloud, Feb 9, 2018.

  1. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Article in the Guardian Friday Feb 9th 2018

    'Substantial minority' of disability claimants failed by system – MPs

    https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ity-failed-by-assessment-system-mps-committee


     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
  2. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
  3. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  4. Luther Blissett

    Luther Blissett Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I've scanned it and it isn't clear to me who is involved in the sample.

    • Were people who were denied a claim involved?
    • What were the response rates for different claim outcomes? (awarded, awarded after appeals, not awarded, etc)
    Without this information, how is the sample representative of people who have contact with the DWP in regard the survey?

    I also cannot see willingness to respond being equal across all groups. If a claimant was traumatised, had difficulties, or was denied a claim, why would they want to open a letter or respond to a telephone call from the DWP (or proxy)?

    The statistical part is included in the appedix to the report for those looking.
     
  5. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Maybe the full report will have more information as to how the DWP collated the initial sample group candidates; but it seems that all of the sample were starting a new claim :

    Footnote 2 of the Interim Headline Findings gives a link to this

    Ipsos MORI/DWP (2017). Personal Independence Payment Evaluation: Wave one Claimant Survey Findings.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...211/pip-evaluation-wave-1-claimant-survey.pdf

    my bold and formatting


    edit: several for clarity and content and general fog battling
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
  6. Luther Blissett

    Luther Blissett Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks Skycloud! :hug:

    I was curious as I was asked to take part in an ESA survey. I was asked after the claim was awarded.

    Another thing that struck me was the usage of percentages instead of numbers in the written summary. 70 odd percent saying something was ok sounds reasonable (if uninspiring) if you don't think too much. When you convert the percentage into numbers, then extrapolate the numbers into total claimants, then not so much.

    The latest numbers I can find for PIP are
    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/dwp-statistical-summaries-2017

    So, if you read the next quote with that context, it becomes a disgrace.

    (emphasis added)

    In any other type of job involving 'customers' (as they like to call us) how would those numbers be acceptable?

    Stopping there as it's making me angry.
     
  7. ArtStu

    ArtStu Established Member

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    I waited over two hours to be seen at my last ESA assessment because they book in more people than they can see, using that 25% not turning up rate, it nearly killed me. I was one of the last to go in, so all those waiting with me could have been there for an hour and a half and then got sent home.
     
  8. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    There was a figures for that in there. I think it was appx 70% were awarded something. Sorry - didn't make notes.
     
  9. Arnie Pye

    Arnie Pye Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    @Skycloud

    Your link in post #1 doesn't work for me.

    The first few characters of the link are : "http:// https://www."
     
  10. ladycatlover

    ladycatlover Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Very chuffed to find that part of my evidence was quoted! :) On the second page, Patient Experiences.

     
  11. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks for letting me know Arnie Pye - I've reposted and it's working for me now
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
  12. Arnie Pye

    Arnie Pye Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    It's working for me too. :thumbup::)
     
  13. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  14. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    "It seems that no-one has examined the validity and reliability of the survey cited, it has simply been taken at face value. It’s assumed that the methodology, intepretation and underlying motives are neutral, value-free. Objective. In fact the survey has been described as “scientific” by at least one Conservative MP."

    :laugh: ha, welcome to the world of BPS research

    eta:
    "In other words, those people with reason to be very dissatisfied with the Department for Work and Pensions and PIP process – those who haven’t been awarded PIP, for example – are not included in the survey.....
    Given that people who are not awarded PIP make up a significant proportion of the PIP customer population who have registered for a claim, this will skew the survey result, slanting it towards positive responses."

    "If the purpose of a survey like this is to produce a valid account of levels of ‘customer satisfaction’ with the Department, then it must include a representative sample of all of those ‘customers’, and include those whose experiences have been negative. "

    "“Please also note that there was a methodological change to the way that Attendance Allowance, Disability Living Allowance and Personal Independence Payment customers were sampled in 2015/16 which means that for these benefits results for 2015/16 are not directly comparable with previous years.”
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
  15. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The full report is now available. I've also added these links to the post at the start of the thread.

    PIP and ESA assessments: Full Report

    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmworpen/829/82902.htm


    pdf version:
    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmworpen/829/829.pdf
     
  16. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    "The Department will need to consider whether the market is capable of delivering assessments at the required level and of rebuilding claimant trust. If it cannot—as already floundering market interest may suggest—the Department may well conclude assessments are better delivered in house."

    ie like they used to be!

    It is ridiculous that they contract it out to companies who then have to hire people (potentially taking them away from the NHS) and re-train them to do the assessments
    in addition to
    sending a form to the GP to fill out to ask mostly the same questions (esa113 https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...hment_data/file/251339/esa113-interactive.pdf for ESA and https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/requ.../3/1949 Attachment 1.pdf?cookie_passthrough=1 for PIP note from what I can gather on the net the GPs are paid to fill out these reports)

    not to mention the assessment centres, the hoo-haa involved to try and get a home visit when the AC is too far to get to.

    whereas they used to be carried out at your GP's practice (I think the last one of those I did was with one of the nurses). So less stress, and less problems getting there for the patient, more likely to feel a genuine assessment is made, the member of staff can still do their normal NHS work in between.

    By all means pay the GP practices more for the service instead of paying the likes of ATOS...........it's still going to work out cheaper. I would have thought it was a no brainer, but what do I know.....:D
     
  17. Skycloud

    Skycloud Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    On the whole I like the report, though I do wonder what I'm missing..

    Considering half the committee were Conservatives (party of government, therefore might be expected to be less critical) it was better than I expected.

    I know!! :facepalm: So ridiculous and stupid.
     
  18. Invisible Woman

    Invisible Woman Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    That wasn't my experience while assessments were done in-house. They wanted me to go to an assessment centre that was a total nightmare to get to. There was a closer centre, but I wasnt allowed go there because it wasn't my area. I spoke to the doc and the feeling was I should ask for a home assessment.

    The GPs surgery was not an option.
     
  19. MEMarge

    MEMarge Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    You and Yours tomorrow 12.15 radio 4 are following this issue re PIP etc
     

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