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Pulse: "Revealed: How patients referred to mental health services end up back with their GP"

Discussion in 'Health News and Research unrelated to ME/CFS' started by Andy, Nov 26, 2018.

  1. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

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    http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/clinica...es-end-up-back-with-their-gp/20037700.article
     
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  2. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    And yet we have this nonsense:



    So, half of half is a success story that is just about the same as 50% success (hardly a glowing success when you're at random chance levels). As long as you massage this half and don't bother looking too deeply about what it means to be recovered, which likely includes people who simply don't come back because it was utterly useless to their case.

    Reminds me of when Trump lost a critical vote in Congress. He argued that if you don't count the votes against, they nearly had 100% of the votes.

    Galactic brains here.
     
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  3. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks for your analysis, @rvallee.

    Seems to be the new, new math these institutions are using.
     
  4. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The Mental Elf sees it all through special BPS rose tinted spectacles
     
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  5. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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    For those who missed this thread
    https://www.s4me.info/threads/bake-off-kim-joy-experience-of-working-in-nhs-mental-health.6918/

    The wisdom of Kim Joy, of the British Bake-off competition, seems worth repeating here in relation to the idea that 'more than 50%' of people who finished IAPT recover:

    Yes.
    30% of people referred to IAPT never begin treatment.

    Of the 70% of people who do start, it seems that 42% only do one session. So that's essentially another 30% of people doing only one session and then dropping out. Together, that's 60% of people referred who don't start or do just one session.

    So, we have a maximum of 40% of people referred for treatment finishing the treatment, but the drop out rate after the second session onwards is probably pretty significant too. The percentage of people referred actually finishing therapy could very easily be only around 20%.

    And then, of that small minority who actually finish the treatment, Kim-Joy tells us that 'a lot of people' are just making up their answers to questions about recovery.

    It's hardly impressive.
     
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  6. ladycatlover

    ladycatlover Moderator Staff Member

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    Sounds rather like the PACE trial doesn't it? :rofl:
     
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  7. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  8. Suffolkres

    Suffolkres Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    NICE technical for ME should rule this out on lack of cost effectiveness then.
     
  9. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Some reasons people might overstate feeling less depressed, anxious etc., after counseling: they want to be done with the treatment, want to move on, their counselor might be a twit, they have found the treatment completely useless, aggravating, upsetting, harmful, their employer, family members, wanted them to get counseling, it's a condition of qualifying for disability assistance, they want to please the therapist, avoid conflict, etc.
     
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  10. TiredSam

    TiredSam Moderator Staff Member

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    Fake maths.
     
  11. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Exactly!
     
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  12. chrisb

    chrisb Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I'm not sure you're allowed to say that. It must be regarded as political. By extension that would make "New Labour" "Fake Labour", which would obviously be a dreadful calumny.
     

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