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Nature: Rein in the four horsemen of irreproducibility

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by Andy, Apr 25, 2019.

  1. Andy

    Andy Committee Member (& Outreach when energy allows)

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    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-01307-2
     
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  2. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    Strange that the author, as an experimental psychologist, says the worst offenders are biomedical scientists. What about the crisis in psychology research?
     
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  3. Barry

    Barry Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Definitely true. Something needs to change so the value of all useful contributions to the sum total of knowledge can be properly recognised. Discovering that something does not show significant effect is often extremely useful. It's so fundamental.
     
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  4. James Morris-Lent

    James Morris-Lent Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The implication I took from it is that 'biomedical science' takes a lot more money and is what we feel holds the most promise for improvement of the human condition. So maybe it's not the worst offender, but its offenses carry the most weight.
     
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  5. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    I think she gave some wishy washy fence sitting comment to SMC - maybe on SMILE. Might have remembered wrong.

    ETA yay my memory is not so bad. http://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-controversial-treatment-for-cfsme/

    Worse than fence sitting psychology rose tinted specs
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2019
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  6. Barry

    Barry Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yes, obviously we focus - rightly so - on the absurdities of much of BPS-driven ME/CFS pseudo science, but I would be amazed if biomedical research is not also prone to dodgy practices.
     
  7. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  8. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    retweeted by Michael Sharpe (!?)


    it takes one to know one
     
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  9. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I actually think all this stuff is a storm in a teacup. The real problem with science is something quite different.

    Why are these studies so hard to reproduce? Because they were tests of not very clever ideas that turned out to be wrong. The real problem with science is that the vast majority of studies test hypotheses that aren't worth bothering with because there are good reasons for thinking they make no sense. Perhaps the commonest thing is testing a hypothesis that superficially looks as if it would explain something but with a bit of thought can be seen not to make those predictions at all.

    The molecular mimicry hypothesis in immunology is an old chestnut. In ME I am sceptical about any hypotheses that try to explain symptoms on the basis of impaired energy metabolism. The symptoms don't fit with that because they occur after the exertion more than during it.

    If you come across a really good idea, which if you are lucky you do once or twice in a career, then the results shout back at you that it is right. P values are not even needed.
     
  10. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I'm not sure if he's tweeting it in support of those. Seeing as it would essentially lead to retraction of most of his work, it's hard to imagine otherwise. Unless he just doesn't understand that, which is conceivable but... damn. He's certainly made it plenty clear he is a fool.
     
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  11. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    Mod note: I've started a new thread to discuss this, moving my post and a reply.
    Do ME symptoms fit with the faulty energy metabolism hypothesis?
     

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