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ME/CFS success story: Lightning Process on Youtube 2019

Discussion in 'PsychoSocial ME/CFS News' started by John Mac, Aug 21, 2019.

  1. John Mac

    John Mac Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Phil Parker of the Lightning Process has uploaded a "success" story to Youtube.
    If you're logged in to Youtube you can unlike it.



     
  2. strategist

    strategist Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Also report the video for fraudulent content.
     
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  3. Cinders66

    Cinders66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I don’t think we can say it’s necessarily fraudulent.

    I think that the CFS dilution from 200 000 to up to 2m is possibly behind some of this, plus potential conflation with pvf. However there’s still allegedly a dramatic turn around in these people.

    I never understand how people who describe themselves as virtually housebound manage to do a course out of house that requires 3 consecutive days of attendance afaik.

    Until we have lots of hard biomedical research evidence for CFS it’s difficult to see these LP claims really having to have more science behind them.
     
  4. strategist

    strategist Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    He could just hire someone to pose as patient that made a dramatic recovery. Even if the testimonial is real, the claims aren't supported by reliable evidence. Similar claims led to the advertisment standards agency to intervene. Parker is probably hoping that on Youtube he can get a free pass.
     
  5. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I think people should be kept to same standard as being clear of cancer ie if you’re symptom free for 5 years you can said to be clear. Although apparently some cancer doctors only use remission even then.
     
  6. JES

    JES Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yep and he probably didn't even need to hire an actor. People are willing to claim much more outrageous things, like being abducted by aliens or that homeopathy or prayer cured their diseases and most of them are probably even honestly believing what they claim. Well, at least he hasn't disabled comments yet, so people can read what the community thinks below.
     
  7. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    How do you see comments?
     
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  8. Marky

    Marky Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Coincidentally that girl is becoming a LP-practitioner.. Blatant scam
     
  9. John Mac

    John Mac Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Weird.
    2 hours ago when I clicked on view on youtube and looked at the video the likes = 4, Dislikes = 29.
    There were at least a dozen negative comments including mine and just one positive comment.

    Now when I view it the Likes/Dislikes is not showing votes and apart from my own comment being displayed all the other negative comments have disappeared and only about 10 positive comments are showing some of which are referring to negative comments which aren't showing anymore.

    Are the Likes/Dislikes and negative comments showing for anyone else or is it just me?
    My user name is John mac, is my comment showing to anyone else?
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
  10. Forbin

    Forbin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Wow... this is powerful stuff. Just watching that testimonial cured me! [What a savings!]
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
  11. Forbin

    Forbin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I just noticed the same thing. I don't know much about how YouTube works, but can the people who post videos go in and remove any comment they want?
     
  12. John Mac

    John Mac Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Apparently they can

    https://smallbusiness.chron.com/delete-comments-youtube-videos-29997.html

    You have full control over the comments that appear on the video page for videos that you upload to YouTube. If you decide for some reason you want to remove any of the comments left by other users, you can do so with a few simple clicks of your mouse. Similarly, you can remove the comments you leave on your own videos -- as well as those on other videos -- using the same process.
     
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  13. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    It's an advertisement. Nothing more.
    LP is a pyramid selling scheme. You pay to participate, and pay to train to lead groups, then make your money back by duping others.
     
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  14. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

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    The owner of a YouTube channel can remove the ability to up- and down-vote on individual videos, as well as remove any or all comments left, as has been mentioned already, or just remove the ability to comment on the video completely.
     
  15. rainy

    rainy Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    How is the LP able to get so many recovery stories. I don't get it.

    Is the ME diagnosis given that losely, or is there actually a large amount of people with ME that recover spontaneously? I've always thought the percentage was quite small, but the amount of recovery stories from unscientific and unlikely methods seems so large.

    If I tell people I have ME, there's about a 50% chance or more that they will say they know someone that got better using the LP. Of course I don't know if these people were actually better, or just saying they are better like the LP instructs us to do.
     
  16. adambeyoncelowe

    adambeyoncelowe Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I've never heard of anyone I know recovering from it, not even friends of friends.
     
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  17. rainy

    rainy Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    I'm not just confused by the amount of recovery stories, but I'm confused by the amount of people that think positively about the Lightning Process at all. Not meaning to minimize the value people found in it, just expressing honest confusion about what that value is.

    To me the course was such confusing nonsense that I don't even understand how it would be possible to implement it. Even for things like self-esteem or excess worry, which are things Phil Parker recommends LP for.

    I don't understand how I could use it for emotional issues, unless I had been a huge fan of walking in circles and saying weird things repetitively a hundred times a day. For me that would be emotionally unhealthy. I always wonder if these people somehow took a different LP than I did, or what it is I missed.
     
  18. rainy

    rainy Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    I also wonder why the LP marketing is so targeted towards ME, when Phil Parker says it also cures eczema amongst other things. My sister has eczema, but doesn't get recommended the LP every time she's in public. And no health practitioner would ever dream of suggesting she tried the LP. But we're supposed to take his claims of curing ME seriously, for some reason?
     
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  19. richie

    richie Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    Psychocentral cases. Plus those on the way to remission in need of a push and those in the overlap.
    Theoretically maybe some with a virus who are so distraught that their immune system will not deal with the virus so they an never remit.

    Gupta would probably point up all manner of Pavlovian possibilities - the body confusing stress and emotional arousal with a former virus as the former virus caused stress - dirty processing in the hypothalamus/amygdyla, whereever.

    As with CBT/GET objective understanding is secondary to plausibilty and delivery style - LP has advocates who failed on Gupta, vice versa etc.

    No point arguing the science for that reason. Belief in therapy part of therapy etc.

    To accept psychocentral ME as consistent with ME criteria i.e the syndrome, is perilous. To deny it is perilous for other reasons. If they walk, sit or lie among us should we not admit it so sifting out can begin?

    Sifting - panels of tests needed and the utter abandonment of the idea that we do not want to get better and will hang on to symptoms if found objectively ill.

    Sadly though LP does not assert hanging onto symptoms prior to LP, many graduates and practitioners suggest those who failing after/during LP do indeed not wish to get better or do not try hard enough. Curiously some then do Gupta and do get better -and vice versa.

    Gupta returns your money, so fair enough imo. None of these therapies can be fully objective and frank and work so money back seems imo to be about as good as it can get.

    Everyone knows about depression nowadays, so just tell folk that some need therapy some, need pills and some both and therapies and pills differ.If they can accept that for depression they should not insist on a single approach for ME. This should even shut up those who believe ME is a mental illness.
     
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  20. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I think that happens on controversial videos, YT removes the likes dislikes to prevent bots from knowing if their vote counted. There was probably a trigger on weird activity as well, as fake comments would come from the same computer and seem suspicious, in addition to the reports.

    When I commented there were several organic comments but they were all removed and now all the comments are obvious fakes. I can see mine but most likely others can't, another measure to annoy bots and astroturfing outlets.

    Not much we can do but the suspicious activity probably downgraded the video. Not that it would get shared much anyway, it's an infomercial.
     
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