Lightning Process: Evidence that participants are taught or expected to misrepresent or lie about their symptoms

[forestglip]

I've come across the claim that the Lightning Process (LP) intervention, at least in some cases, includes coaches teaching patients to misrepresent or lie about their symptoms to others.

If this were true, any trials of the LP which rely on subjective outcomes would be completely unreliable as indicators of improvement because patients would be taught to give a false answer for the subjective outcome itself. For the same reason, anecdotes about the benefits of the LP would be virtually useless, even if very large numbers of such positive anecdotes existed.

I never came across a compiled collection of evidence for the above, so here I want to collect all anecdotes or other evidence that participants of the LP are taught or expected to present a misleading account of their symptoms to others. I'll also include other reasons that accounts of improvement due to the LP may be uniquely unreliable, such as feelings of shame or guilt if the participant does not say they have improved.

Let me know if there are other accounts, and I'll add them here.

---

Published Research

Experiences of young people who have undergone the Lightning Process to treat chronic fatigue syndrome/myalgic encephalomyelitis – a qualitative study, Reme et al, 2012

Alternative viewpoints brought up by the young people would not be well received, and a few experienced a normative pressure to be happy all the time and not express any negative feelings, which they found difficult.

News articles

(BBC) Long Covid course is ‘exploiting people’, says ex-GB rower

In secret recordings by the BBC [...] The coach on the course stressed the importance of avoiding negative thoughts and words like "pain" and "fatigue", claiming using them can continue symptoms.

Blogs/Other online accounts

Anecdotes on website "LP Does Not Work For Me"

Person #1:​

I must admit that I too would have written a glowing testimonial during the five weeks after because I was still 'geed up' by the process. Also, because the process instructs you to only concentrate on the positive, it is a very convenient method of filtering out any negative and adverse comments. For instance, Phil asked us to email him a few weeks after our training with a progress report but he specifically told us to only mention the positive things that had happened to us and not to mention any negative feelings, symptoms or experiences we'd had, obviously with the laudable aim of concentrating our minds on the positive. It also has the convenient benefit of providing purely positive testimonials for the LP.

I was severely disappointed that the Lightning Process hadn't worked for me, and when I realised it had actually harmed my health as well, then I did actually try to forget about it for a while whilst I tried to regain a tolerable level of health again. It has taken a considerable length of time for me to realise that in no way was I to blame for the fact that the LP didn't cure me and in fact made me more ill. I suspect there may be many others like me, who are unable to admit that it didn't work for them, either because they are too ill, too embarrassed or still brainwashed into believing that it's their fault that it didn't work.

Person #2:​

However, the mere fact I had paid so much money meant I was going to do exactly as they told me: it had worked for others and it could work for me. We were told to do The Process thirty times that evening. I went back to my guest house and did as I was told. I spoke to my loved ones but when they asked how it went I was reluctant to talk about it. The tutor said that if we tell people about the process if won't work. That's right, to talk about the process means it can't work for you. She also told us that no matter how she feels she tells everyone she "feels fabulous". I wasn't quite ready to tell people I felt fabulous but equally I didn't tell anyone how much the first day had tired me because that is a negative thought and that must be countered, so I did my thirty processes, went for a walk and then to bed.

If anyone says anything she thinks is negative we are interrupted and corrected.

At one point she left the room. It felt very naughty but I whispered to one of the women sitting next to me, "How are you? Is this working for you?" She was reluctant to answer, to say anything but that she was doing well would be to go against the process because that is a negative thought. It was pointless asking, really.

(Podcast, 'Medical Error Interviews'): 'Alice Urbino: scam ‘lightning process’ causes internalized gaslighting - beware of charlatans'

You're not allowed to say the word "tired" or "ME", like you're not allowed to ever say any words relating to it. And if you do, they, like, scold you. So they ask you how you feel, and you say "I'm tired". They go "wrong, you're not allowed to say that." And it's like, so I'm just supposed to lie all the time, I guess. I'm supposed to just pretend I'm not feeling what I'm feeling.

Joan McParland

(Podcast, 'Medical Error Interviews'): 'Joan McParland interview: “I have been conned” - When sick patients are sold psychological snake oil'​

We went outside, which we were told, when you go out, do not talk about anything that has happened in the room that day. Don't discuss it.

You were told, do never talk in anything, only positive words, positive terms. So Paula and I used to have these stupid conversations on the phone. "What did you do today, Paula?" Or "what are you going to do?". "Well, I'm going to get washed and showered and dressed, and I'm going to go shopping." That's what you were told to do. So you were that scared and you were that, probably, annoyed about spending 880 quid. You were going to do that. You were going "I'm going to speak in positive terms and try and do all these things". And as the time went on, our health was going down and down and down, and then we had to admit to each other, "this is a load of crap". It's mind games.

And then he told you, ring anybody you have at home. That was my husband. And remember to speak positive terms only. Do not be negative. So I rang my husband and told him I was cured.

Trial By Error: Joan McParland’s Lightning Process Experience​

We were not allowed to discuss the process with other sufferers but just to do it and recover. We were told to cut off all contact with other M.E. sufferers and when asked about LP to say we were cured. We were told to ignore symptoms and keep saying we were cured regardless. I know this sounds crazy but the coach was excellent at his job of VERY high-pitched sales and the people he was selling to were very desperate to get better.

LP-Fortellinger (LP-stories)

Person #1​

we were instructed to tell ourselves and the world that we had recovered.

We participants were encouraged to stay in touch, support each other and “stand together against negative attitudes”. – In other words we learned to lie to ourselves, we learned to suppress symptoms and we fancied we were recovered.

We also signed a declaration that we had recovered: On the third and last day of the course we filled out a form where one of the questions was: “Do you have ME?”. We answered “NO” – Because we had learned that we had to stop “doing ME”.

Afterwards the forms were collected, with the participants signatures on that we no longer have ME. – Afterwards, these answers were used as recovery numbers from LP-courses. Many have tried to get the forms back without luck. LP-instructors and their supporters claim this is not true, but I can swear that those at our course did this. Many I’ve been in contact with who have also participated on an LP-course confirm this.

​

Person #2​

On the way home I got a bad flu and became very poorly. I mentioned this to the coach during a follow-up conversation. It ended in a reprimande

Proud and stubborn as I am, I lied to everyone: friends, colleagues, family and myself. So I pushed myself and kept going on adrenaline for as long as I could. But I didn’t recover, and still haven’t.

While I was still on adrenaline and pretending to myself and others that I had recovered, I recommended LP to other ME patients.

Person #3​

Finally, we were given a piece of paper where we had to tick and sign that we had recovered during the course. After having learned over three days that we were to tell ourselves and others that we were healthy, we perceived it as an intervention and part of the course. A contract with ourselves in line with “fake it until you make it” as S. P. said, and if you didn’t sign, you were not willing to try the premise for the course you’d just paid 20 000 NOK for. This was confirmed by the instructor who knew were were not at the finish line yet, so of course we all signed it.

Person #4​

The most worrying aspect about observing my sister after she had been treated with Lightning Process, was how I felt she had been trained to lie. She was to answer all questions in a positive way, because if she let in any negative thoughts, she would make herself sick again. When I asked her how she was doing, she answered that she was “bubbling over with energy”. When I asked if she wanted to go to the movies, she answered “YES”. When I asked about her symptoms, such as the acute muscle pain, she replied that she did not “do” muscle pain anymore, because her symptoms were not something she had, it was something she did, and with rephrasing she could also take responsibility for them.

Person #5​

From now on, we were to live as recovered and break with the past, tell others that we were healthy

Person #6​

On the last day of the course, we proclaimed loud and clear that we did not DO ME anymore! We had recovered! I was in a “hallelujah mode” after the course. I constantly said to myself I had recovered. I did the LP process countless times. Everywhere. Anytime. I refused to listen to my body – even though it told me I wasn’t the slightest bit better.

Person #7​

On the last day of the course we had to sign a document, a self-declaration that the course had made us recovered. Since the LP method itself is about saying out loud to oneself and others that one is recovered, I signed that yes, I was recovered. Had I not done so, I would have technically “failed” the course and not used the method correctly.

In other words this means that I today am still counted among the “recovered” group, even if I certainly didn’t, and still am not.

Person #8​

The course leader said it was my own fault if I didn’t recover, and on the last day of the course I was asked to sign that I was 100% recovered whether I felt it was right or not, because it was part of the treatment.

Person #9​

Before the end of the day, we are also encouraged to call friends and family and tell them we have recovered. HURRAY! The more people we told, the better. Preferably loudly and with enthusiasm.

The next day begins with the question; How many did you talk to?

I have people who are still offended that I lied to them. I can understand why.

Person #10​

The hardest thing to think back on is how I lied to those around me, directly and indirectly. I said I was healthy. During the periods when I was very ill I avoided answering people. I didn’t know what to say anymore. I also came up with a lot of excuses for my symptoms, which was not that I was doing ME. It was flu season, pollen season, Monday or Friday. This is how I maintained the lie.

Person #11​

We had to sign that we were better. When your body is full of adrenaline, and you have been completely brainwashed, you just sign it. We were completely overrun by the facilitators.

Person #12​

Even though I almost crawled out of the course room the last day, I was supposed to say I was completely healthy.

[Reached post character limit. See post #19 for more.]

Posts from S4ME members

User #1

When I did the LP, one of the things we learned was to exaggerate the way we talk about our health in a positive way.

Then on day two we did an exercise were we had to get up in front of the group and talk about how much we had been able to do after the first day of LP, and how wonderful we had felt.

We were told to use big, strong body language, and use words like "incredible, amazing, wonderful" - only strong positive words, about how great we felt and how much we had done. The rest of the group should judge if we had exaggerated strongly enough, and if they thought we didn't, we had to do it over again.

User #2

Also remembering this day two of the course as particularly insane, first attending the course day one, then instructed to go out and “enjoy” no matter what. Then on day two to put on a smile and lie to yourself and all others about what you had done and how wonderfully fine you felt, though awful and PEM. But it didn’t stop there, when coming home and then continuing to lie to yourself and friends. Yepp, I’m not ill anymore. Totally brainwashed. Fascinating in hindsight. But it was like this; I have to try, have to lie and go on, see where this goes, even when experiencing that you were heading in a totally wrong direction and straight into the ditch.

 

[DigitalDrifter]

It's CBT upon steroids, (misleads the same way but amplified).

 

[BrightCandle]

I thought that was a large part the point of the Lightning process, you lie to yourself that you aren't suffering symptoms and to other people and then your body "manifests" the recovery by fixing the errant brain linkage its claiming is the cause. Given that none of its results can ever be trusted and neither can testimonies on it.

 

[dave30th]

Within the framework of the LP, it's not lying or misrepresenting and it's the core part of the whole thing. You're "doing" ME, you don't "have" ME. So by saying "STOP, I want the life I love!" or whatever and putting up your hand, you're no longer "doing" ME. And that means you're cured, within that framework, if you're performing the LP correctly.

And yes, it renders studies invalid, although they were already invalid anyway given the reliance on subjective outcomes in unblinded studies. But that argument about the specific nature of the LP making it hard to get legitimate answers hasn't worked with journals and peer-review committees.

 

[Kitty]

However, the mere fact I had paid so much money meant I was going to do exactly as they told me: it had worked for others and it could work for me. We were told to do The Process thirty times that evening. I went back to my guest house and did as I was told. I spoke to my loved ones but when they asked how it went I was reluctant to talk about it. The tutor said that if we tell people about the process if won't work. That's right, to talk about the process means it can't work for you. She also told us that no matter how she feels she tells everyone she "feels fabulous". I wasn't quite ready to tell people I felt fabulous but equally I didn't tell anyone how much the first day had tired me because that is a negative thought and that must be countered, so I did my thirty processes, went for a walk and then to bed.

We were not allowed to discuss the process with other sufferers but just to do it and recover. We were told to cut off all contact with other M.E. sufferers and when asked about LP to say we were cured. We were told to ignore symptoms and keep saying we were cured regardless.

These strike me as the sort of descriptions you'd only use about a destructive cult.

 

[Trish]

We have multiple threads about LP. This one is particularly relevant I think:
LP-fortellinger - Norwegian website sharing information and experiences about Lightning Process - now available in English
It links to a Norwegian website where people told their experiences of LP. This is my summary from that thread made after reading through all the stories.
In answer to this thread question, yes, a core part of the LP process is that participants are told they have to say they are recovered, they are no longer 'doing' ME/CFS.

I have been reading through the stories. Here are some of the key points that stood out for me.

Enrolment:
Some people were recruited by word of mouth following media stories about LP curing people with ME. Others were recommended to do it by doctors, and some were even expected to do it by the Norwegian employment department before they could get financial support.

Some were children and teenagers. These took a family member with them.

The course is very expensive for a 3 day 'training' of about 5 hours a day in small groups with a trainer.

Enrolment was not automatic on application. Participants had to fill in forms and have phone assessments which were geared around making sure the person was 'ready'. This meant basically being able to convince the trainer that they were suitable subjects for believing and doing everything they were told to do without asking questions, or expressing doubts or negative feelings. They had to say they weren't analytical.

Enrolment on a very expensive course with a process you had to pass to be accepted made the course very enticing. It helped create an aura of excitement that they were going to experience something special and complex and that they were excited and privileged to be accepted. Some were told they weren't ready when they first applied, so they tried harder to put aside any doubts and scientific thinking and to accept everything they were told.

On arrival, or beforehand, not sure which, they all had to sign a confidentiality agreement that they would not tell anyone what the course consisted of. Some were still years later quite frightened about revealing what happened on the course.

The course

Participants, some very sick, were expected to sit on hard upright chairs for hours at a time for 3 days. One asked if they would be allowed to lie down if they needed to and was told that never happened.

No one was allowed to question or criticise anything that was said or done during the course, being told if they did they would be asked to leave.

The course started with some scientific sounding information about the mind affecting physical health, also some pictures of optical iliusions to build the idea that the mind could be tricked into thinking they were physically sick.

They were told they did not 'have ME', they were 'doing ME', and the method would enable them to stop 'doing ME'.

Then they had to learn the method and practice one by one with the trainer in front of the group. This consisted of standing on pieces of paper on the floor and saying NO with an emphatic arm gesture to their symptoms every time they had a thought about experiencing symptoms, or about being sick, and stepping onto another piece of paper choosing between 'the life I love' and 'the pit', and saying aloud that they choose the life they love.

They were told to repeat the process all the time, whenever they started 'doing ME'. At the end of the first day they were told they had to do some sort of activity they hadn't believed they could do, like going to a shopping centre, and report back the next day what they had done.

They were told that part of the process was that they were to tell everyone in their lives that they had recovered, and to get rid of all associations in their home of their sick life, like the clothes the wore when they were 'doing ME', even sofas they rested on. They had to get on with their lives as recovered people and every time they felt symptoms, the had to stop themselves 'doing ME' by repeating the Stop action and chosing the 'life they love'.

Before they left at the end of the third day, they were told that they had to sign a document saying they had recovered. This was justified on the ground that stopping 'doing ME' meant the same as being recovered. Most signed it. Some are now worried that their signing is used for recovery data.

They were told they must not communicate with each other after the course, nor must they look online for anything about ME, or join any online groups or ME organisations, as that would be 'doing ME'. The must also cut ties with any friends with ME.

The immediate effect

A few decided straight away that it was a con and a cult and dismissed it, feeling they had wasted their effort and money. Some of these took a while to recover from the PEM of the 3 days and the trauma of it.

Most believed and tried really hard to do the process, some finding that at first they did have a surge of energy and believed they had recovered and were able to push on for some time. Some felt the effect wear off and were persuaded to pay more to do refresher courses, and to keep doing the method even up to hundreds of times a day. Some described it as a rush of excitement and adrenaline that kept them going through the course and for variable lengths of time afterwards. Some who admitted to their coaches that it wasn't working were told it was their fault, they were doing it wrong, or they didn't want to recover.

The long term effects

All those who stuck with the method and believed it would work ended up sicker than before. Some managed to keep doing it and live more active lives than before the course for some weeks, months or even years, though the longer they kept trying, the more they realised afterwards that actually they had been pushing and crashing and getting sicker overall, but managing to persuade themselves that the crashes had other causes. They had persuaded themselves they had recovered but were actually living far from healthy lives.

All felt they had been conned, most ended up sicker, and quite a few had ongoing psychological problems believing they were failures and it was their fault the process hadn't worked, and their fault they were sick.
Some lost friends and felt awful for having lied to their friends and family by telling them they had recovered.

Several only found they could finally let go of their feeling of failure and stop doing the method once the plucked up courage to look online and found support groups and information about ME, as they had been told not to do.
____________________

My thoughts

Reading some of these stories is very distressing. Lives and families and friendships have been destroyed, people have ended up much sicker, and some still live with ongoing psychological distress related to the process.

I suggest you take them a few at a time. They need to be read and shared widely.

My conclusion

LP is a cult and a dangerous scam. It uses brainwashing to harm its victims, and should be banned everywhere.

 

[Utsikt]

In LP, you are taught to say one thing, regardless of if you believe it or not. Some participants might believe what they say, others might not. The former are deceiving themselves, the latter are both deceiving themselves and others, i.e. lying.

Regardless of if it’s classified as wilfull deception of others, the reality is still that the participants are taught how to answer about their health status. That renders any subjective outcomes completely unreliable.

The participants are also taught how to behave. It’s conceivable that some participants with ME/CFS might be able to push themselves for a few weeks or months, but suffer long term negative consequences after this period. This might also render short term objective outcomes unreliable.

 

[Lou B Lou]

(BTW Lightning Process was Esther Rantzen's daughter's Second 'Cure' from ME)

Daily Mail 2007

Saved from a living death

For 14 years, Esther Rantzen's daughter Emily had her life destroyed by ME. Trapped in a wheelchair, wasting away, she wanted to die. Now, thanks to radical 'mind over matter' therapy, she's cured herself

www.dailymail.co.uk

'Saved from a living death' by Esther Rantzen

'For 14 years, Esther Rantzen's daughter Emily had her life destroyed by ME. Trapped in a wheelchair, wasting away, she wanted to die. Now, thanks to radical "mind over matter" therapy, she's cured herself.'

'As explained in Good Health last month, The Lightning Process is based on the theory that ME is an illness that affects the body's capacity to deal with adrenaline. This is the hormone the body releases when stressed - in people with ME the levels are abnormal, and they need to "train" their brain to normalise the body's response.

The first step is to tackle the thoughts that trigger the stress reaction - halfway through a negative thought they have to tell themselves to stop. This stops the stress response, and in theory creates new connections in the brain, stimulating the production of endorphins - feel-good brain chemicals.

At "600, the course - in Crouch End, London - wasn't cheap. But Jill doesn't believe in miracle cures any more than I do. She thought it was worthwhile, so Emily, now 28, enrolled. It took three days.'




Daily Mail 2011 By Esther Rantzen. (Emily Wilcox's Third 'Cure'. This time from Coeliac'

At last, I have discovered the secret of Emily's 14 lost years, by Esther Rantzen

Could an unknown gluten intolerance be the cause of Emily Rantzen's 'lost 14 years' at the hands of chronic fatigue syndrome?

www.dailymail.co.uk

Esther Rantzen:
'Fatigue. Could it possibly be that the illness that blighted Emily's life, which wrecked her education and isolated her from her friends, the ME that caused her so much suffering, was caused by something as simple as gluten? If so, we could have treated her so easily, and so effectively. But all through those years I knew almost nothing about the disease. I needed the facts.'


Emily:

'No more 'fake it till I feel it'​

By EMILY RANTZEN

In my darkest hours, when I was bed-bound and reliant on a wheelchair, I didn't believe I would one day work full-time, go to university or lead a fully active life.

In the years since my recovery in 2006 [Lightning Process], I've been used to secretly feeling I have to drag myself through life, forcing my body to be active and using mind over matter to 'fake it till I feel it'.

.

 

[forestglip]

We have multiple threads about LP. This one is particularly relevant I think:
LP-fortellinger - Norwegian website sharing information and experiences about Lightning Process - now available in English
It links to a Norwegian website where people told their experiences of LP. This is my summary from that thread made after reading through all the stories.
In answer to this thread question, yes, a core part of the LP process is that participants are told they have to say they are recovered, they are no longer 'doing' ME/CFS.

Thank you, I'm working through adding relevant quotes.

This is such blatant manipulation of statistics, it's amazing:

- https://lp-fortellinger.no/en/2022/02/24/venke-midtlien-2/

We also signed a declaration that we had recovered: On the third and last day of the course we filled out a form where one of the questions was: “Do you have ME?”. We answered “NO” – Because we had learned that we had to stop “doing ME”.

Afterwards the forms were collected, with the participants signatures on that we no longer have ME. – Afterwards, these answers were used as recovery numbers from LP-courses. Many have tried to get the forms back without luck. LP-instructors and their supporters claim this is not true, but I can swear that those at our course did this. Many I’ve been in contact with who have also participated on an LP-course confirm this.

- https://lp-fortellinger.no/en/2022/02/24/kristin-stolen-2/

On the last day of the course we had to sign a document, a self-declaration that the course had made us recovered. Since the LP method itself is about saying out loud to oneself and others that one is recovered, I signed that yes, I was recovered. Had I not done so, I would have technically “failed” the course and not used the method correctly.

In other words this means that I today am still counted among the “recovered” group, even if I certainly didn’t, and still am not.

 

[MrMagoo]

What is a cult? An AI overview
Includes
-devotion to a person or ideal
-manipulation
-isolation from friends and family etc
-harmful practices

 

[Amw66]

Ironically for kids there are huge red flag safeguarding issues with this process .
Being told not to tell your family about things/ things being kept secret being a key safeguarding parameter

 

[John Mac]

Forcing patients to tell everyone that asks that the Lightning Process cured them even if it didn't is a great marketing ploy.
Only 5 star reviews are allowed.

 

[Peter T]

Ironically for kids there are huge red flag safeguarding issues with this process .
Being told not to tell your family about things/ things being kept secret being a key safeguarding parameter

Also this means that any subsequent medical management of children with ME/CFS is likely to be based on misinformation and at its worst could result in misdiagnosis or harmful interventions for other conditions as well as for the ME/CFS.

This attempt at getting children to misrepresent their symptoms ought to be sufficient to block any use of LP with children, so thank you to all collating this information.

 

[Trish]

This attempt at getting children to misrepresent their symptoms ought to be sufficient to block any use of LP with children, so thank you to all collating this information.

I think that's partly why NICE ME/CFS 2021 specifically recommends against LP.

Rationale and impact | Myalgic encephalomyelitis (or encephalopathy)/chronic fatigue syndrome: diagnosis and management | Guidance | NICE

www.nice.org.uk

 

[forestglip]

I think that's partly why NICE ME/CFS 2021 specifically recommends against LP.

Rationale and impact | Myalgic encephalomyelitis (or encephalopathy)/chronic fatigue syndrome: diagnosis and management | Guidance | NICE

www.nice.org.uk

Yes, though their evidence for the misrepresentation of symptoms is only the published Reme, Chalder study I quoted, and they don't say too much about this specific point. The following from NICE guidelines evidence review is almost a direct quote from the study.

Alternative viewpoints brought up by the young people were not well- received and a few experienced pressure to be happy all the time and not express any negative feelings.

And this is their overall conclusion about LP:

The Lightning Process
Evidence on children and young people’s experiences of the Lightning Process showed that although some aspects of the therapy such as goal setting, practical examples and applications and peer support were found to be helpful, experiences varied and some negative experiences were reported around the confusing nature of the educational component, the intensity of the sessions, the secrecy surrounding the therapy, the approach of some therapists which led to feelings of pressure and blame and dishonesty about the success rate.

The committee were particularly concerned around the secrecy of the Lightning Process and the lack of public information on the components and implementation of the process.

The committee discussed concerns that the Lightning Process encourages people to ignore their symptoms and push through them and this could potentially result in harm for people with ME/CFS.

The committee noted they had made clear recommendations on the principles of energy management and this is at odds with the principles of energy management in the guideline.

In addition, the committee were aware that some children had been told not to discuss the therapy with their carer or parents. The committee agreed this
was an inappropriate and harmful message to give to children and young people.

The committee considered these findings were applicable to adults as well as children and young people and therefore, the committee decided to make a recommendation not to offer therapies based on the Lightning Process for ME/CFS.

I believe "pressure" is the one bit that corresponds to that part of the study about "pressure to be happy all the time and not express any negative feelings". But they criticize plenty of other aspects as well, like children being discouraged from discussing what happened in the sessions.

 

[wastwater]

I award this lightning process a silly sauce award

 

[Lou B Lou]

Adults Coercing children to keep secrets is a massive Safeguarding Red Flag. The Smile Trial should have failed Ethical Approval for that reason alone. But the Research Ethics Committee were not informed about the nuts and bolts of Lightning Process .... because .... it's a Secret.

 

[dave30th]

This attempt at getting children to misrepresent their symptoms ought to be sufficient to block any use of LP with children, so thank you to all collating this information.

I'm pretty sure this was raised in the ethical concerns broached about the Crawley study when it was launching.

 

[forestglip]

There are so many stories that the forum software won't let me put them all in one post, so adding more here:

---

LP-Fortellinger (LP-stories) [Continued]

Person #13​

I also remember that we were supposed to tell those around us that we had recovered.

Person #14​

I had to sign that I didn’t do ME anymore. The coach didn’t accept the answers when I ranked from 1 (bad) to 10 (best) and always pushed up. This was in front of the group, so that I felt pressured to say better to make her happy, and not to ruin it for the others by being negative.

Person #15​

We were almost forced to sign that we had recovered from the course.

The charismatic and experienced course leader was placed at the narrow exit door, and we could not leave the room without saying that we no longer “did ME” and that we were recovered, as well as signing that we had recovered.

This is the whole key to success of the concept. And the basis for the good recovery statistic they’re constantly referring to.

It is no wonder “everyone” recovers, when the method involves lying to both oneself and others and claiming that one is completely healthy, even if one is definitely not. I assume the other participants were as exhausted as me after three days with the course, so we signed without much protest.

And it actually still hurts that I had to lie to family and friends and say I’d recovered, when I did not feel well at all.

Person #16​

Finally, we all had to sign on a piece of paper that we were now healthy and no longer doing ME.

I had a lot of symptoms, but couldn’t tell anyone.

I have had a very hard time reclaiming my identity after the course. Accepting the disease again has been very tough. I still have some bad habits that I struggle to rid myself of: such as having to pretend I’m perfectly healthy in front of others, and only to rest in my own company.

I feel guilty if I complain of symptoms (even at the doctor).

Person #17​

We had to sign that the process had worked, and to not tell about the method to others.

Person #18​

Yes, we had to sign a form stating that we were recovered. I was weak and lying on the floor. As I was doing ME, and since I actually was completely recovered (I just had to do the process and train my mind and body), I signed.

I have since wondered whether these signatures form the basis for the Lightning Process system to claim that they get people to recover. In that case it’s on very meagre grounds, when I know that I was completely exhausted after three days on the course.

Person #19​

I didn’t like that we had to answer yes or no to whether we were recovered on the last day.

I didn’t feel recovered, but that I was on the right track.

I felt I had to answer yes, otherwise I “didn’t want it enough”.

Person #20​

I remember best the feeling of pressure regarding the contract we had to sign. I felt they looked down on me because I questioned why we had to sign that we were recovered, even if we weren’t.

 

[MrMagoo]

You know what, it’s not actually that much more extreme than the old CBT based on GET.