Improvement of ME/CFS during an infection

[StellariaGraminea]

Reading this, I realise I don’t have what people are describing.
My symptoms feel worse during an infection, not better, my function sometimes improves but its quite attributable to being deep in the wired state.

I mostly don't either. It only happened once with a mild cold several years ago that I can think of. Other localised infections e.g. this recurring skin infection I get, are associated with worsening for me more usually. (Though in this last case, I think the infection is a symptom of my immune system "going down" first rather than the infection causing of worsening, if that makes sense. I also get things like mouth ulcers at the same time & it all feels secondary to immune issue).

 

[BrightCandle]

Reading this, I realise I don’t have what people are describing.
My symptoms feel worse during an infection, not better, my function sometimes improves but its quite attributable to being deep in the wired state.

Every infection I have just felt worse, for the years up to the pandemic, with Covid itself also causing a monumentally bad crash to considerably worse still. I don't feel better on infections at all.

 

[Spartacus]

I have long wondered why the medical profession hasn't looked into this phenomenon more, as it would surely give insight into the nature of ME.

I had the very first version of Covid, before the jabs were brought out.
I was very ill with a high fever, but somehow I simultaneously felt fantastic. All my ME pain and brain fog just disappeared. I managed to read several books.
The effect lasted 3 weeks after the Covid symptoms disappeared. During that time I had extreme tiredness and wanted to sleep a lot, but it was significantly different from the fatigue of ME and far less unpleasant than ME. I foolishly thought that perhaps my ME was gone permanently. It wasn't.

Unfortunately only a person who has suffered from ME seems to be able to distinguish the difference between the"tiredness" experienced during a viral infection, and the crippling fatigue of ME. To doctors it just all seems to be lumped together as "fatigue". No doctor has been in the slightest bit interested when I have tried to explain it.

 

[Peter T]

Have we done a poll on this before?

 

[BrightCandle]

I have long wondered why the medical profession hasn't looked into this phenomenon more, as it would surely give insight into the nature of ME.

We lack entirely the infrastructure to research transient phenomena associated with the disease. There is a reason CPETs are being used to induce crashes because zero infra exists to monitor patients and investigate events such as remissions or infections or anything else. Patients talk about these things but research and medicine has shown no interest. It would be a good idea to investigate it but we know medicine isn't going to and research has also shown almost no interest in investigating severe patients other than a few studies where home self sample collection was possible.

 

[jnmaciuch]

Small Q: Does "negatively" here mean that it increases interferon signalling or that it reduces it?

meaning increased prostaglandin signaling -> decreased interferon signaling

 

[Arfmeister]

On a metabolic/mitochondrial level this might be happening:

Cells shift from stuck in hypometabolic state that is ME to the hypermetabolic state w sepsis. Hypermetabolic state causes cells to actually ramp up metabolism which feels better. In sepsis there are stages which occur very similar to ME

So from a Hypometabolic Phase:
- Mitochondrial Failure: Mitochondria become dysfunctional, leading to ATP production failure and energy crisis leading to a Impaired Immune Response, because of metabolically impaired exhausted immune cells

Virus / Bacteria ⇒ shift Hypermetabolic Phase: fight infection
- Energy Surge: Cells ramp up metabolism, breaking down fats, carbs, and proteins for rapid energy.
- Glycolysis Dominates: Immune cells switch to rapid aerobic glycolysis (Warburg effect) for quick energy, producing lactate.