Discussion in 'Recruitment into current ME/CFS research studies' started by dreampop, May 5, 2020.
Hmm. From Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_water:
I wonder what outcome measurements the study uses, especially if they're going to focus on brain fog. By "controlled pilot trial", do they mean that there will be a placebo group? Seems essential given the woo-woo claims for hydrogen rich water.
But at least it should be a harmless supplement to try.
Wondering what effect being 'hydrogen rich' has on the pH of water.
So how is it stored in pills? And if you dissolve them to water, surely the H2 would just bubble quickly to the surface and be lost in the air.
The pills cost a lot.
As he summed up the scientific literature on the therapeutic uses of hydrogen, I got enthused about its potential...
When researchers get enthused about the potential of a novel idea/treatment, I get nervous.
Double-blinded, placebo-controlled study:
These results suggest that HRW may reinforce QOL through effects that increase central nervous system functions involving mood, anxiety, and autonomic nervous function.
If this treatment improves autonomic function then that would be a plus.
I'm looking forward to read this study when it's over. For now I'm very skeptical.
"Oh, so you have ME? Here, drink some water and become much better or cure it."
That has been my dream last 4 years!
If this 'treatment' helps improve autonomic issues for pwME, then that would improve QOL.
If I didn't have to lie down every half hour I would be a lot more functional!
Without some special explanation as to why this does actually make sense when anyone who has done chemistry at school is likely to think it doesn't, I have to assume it is pseudoscience.
As far as I know we all generate our own hydrogen in quite considerable amounts - as one of the major constituents of flatus. It is said that medical students used to test this by lighting each other's farts.
Molecular hydrogen is fairly insoluble in water except under high pressure. It is also fairly inert under biological conditions as far as I know. I cannot think of any way to tore molecular hydrogen in a solid pill.
It would be intriguing to know if it really is possible.
Ik like how you phrased that sentence. It is said...
So it’s possibly not going to cause physical harm to those who rush to try it for themselves but as usual it will definitely damage their budgets. I find myself unable to summon any enthusiasm at all. Presumably one day someone is going to have some kind of genui breakthrough but I’m far to cynical to go for this. All I can hear in my head is magic water........
eta tweaked after seeing Wonkos subsequent post - concern that harmful effects may not be being looked for.
I wouldn't be so sure it's not harmful.
Gases dissolved in water can change the pH (acidity), CO2 dissolved in water is supposed to have changed the pH enough to cause problems for marine life, fish, plankton, reefs etc.
At least according to odd bits that have come up over the years, it's not just temperature causing problems for water borne life.
I have no idea what effect an extra 7% hydrogen in water would have, but that's significantly more than the percentage of squash I add to water and that makes a big difference
...and at the end of the day, if it wasn't thought to do something, something that had a noticeable effect, then why bother - is anyone looking at the negative side of the coin.
Where does the 7% come from, Wonko?
A review I read said they tested and it was 1.2 parts per million in their hydrogen water.
Small eyesight malfunction is where it came from.
The most interesting thing I've seen was from @Hip on PR who highlighted this paper where it is thought hydrogen rich water stimulates ghrelin release in the stomach
Oral ‘hydrogen water’ induces neuroprotective ghrelin secretion in mice
ghrelin is one of the topics that @mariovitali highlighted last year on s4me and on his blog
I just wanted to add that we may be hearing more about Mitofusin-2 (MFN-2) in the future. Recall that Dr Davis mentioned a "sepsis-like" condition :
Regarding H2, Study in mice :
From another study, H2 in Lung Injury. I assume that MMP is Mitochondrial membrane Potential :
There are also a number of posts in PR about MFN-2 as early as 2013.
And not unrelated to mitochondrial fusion, Interesting.
On another note, I can't help but wonder... if you take an H2 pill form and it really does work, is that creating a lot of bloating in the digestive track?
Room temperature hydrogen? So, ahh, am supposta put that in the fridge, then the fuse-ion box.
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