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Dysania article,”inability to get out of bed in mornings” mentions CFS

Discussion in 'PsychoSocial ME/CFS News' started by Cinders66, Oct 27, 2018.

  1. Cinders66

    Cinders66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    This vague article, although seemingly primarily about a depressive symptom, seems to lump in CFS. I’m not sure im comfortable, especially as I’m bedridden not with a feeling of not wanting to get up but a body that would go beserk if I did. I’ve not a great deal of understanding about physically incapacitating depression or how it works to incapacitate them to not being able to leave bed, I can understand mood making people not want to leave the bed but don’t understand why it would affect movement. Having it written with CFS, not a mood /anxiety disorder but a function/energy one is uncomfortable to me.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcthree/article/622c8a79-23cf-4887-a5d1-6ed4a81192bf

    Possibly based on this worse article here:

    https://psych2go.net/the-difficulty-of-getting-out-of-bed-in-the-morning-is-called-dysania/
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2018
  2. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

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    Author is Ben Bryant
    https://www.benbryant.co.uk/
    Email is bbwbryant@gmail.com, and Twitter is https://twitter.com/benbryant?lang=en, if anybody wants to ask him how he knows this
     
  3. Peter Trewhitt

    Peter Trewhitt Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    It feels that the psychobabble about ME has gained such momentum, that not only does PACE and the Cochrane reviews need retracting, not only does the NICE endorsement of GET/CBT need dropping, none a forgone conclusion, but also there needs to be an attitude shift in the both a large section of the medical profession and the general public.

    How on earth does one achieve that? It can be hard enough to get change in our nearest friends and family. Obviously films like Unrest achieve a lot, but how to move further?

    Sorry, this is slightly off topic, but it is feeling a bit at present one step forward, two steps back, whilst there is an ever growing literature of misleading and just plan wrong research and information.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2018
  4. Wonko

    Wonko Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    There's only one thing guaranteed to achieve this, in a short enough period to prevent more people being harmed, by CBT/GET and the BPS approach - a slingshot of the Earth into the Sun's corona, followed by a long cooling off period :grumpy:

    This might, might, provide an opportunity to get it right in future, assuming the Earth is captured by another star compatible with some form of 'advanced' life for long enough for one to evolve.

    Basically time for a reset, it works for computers, I see no reason it wouldn't work for a planet, assuming the universe lasted long enough it's bound to fix the problem.

    The logistics, as I've mentioned before. are of course, problematic.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2018
  5. obeat

    obeat Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    So most teenagers must have dysania!
     
  6. duncan

    duncan Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Symptoms that accompany channelopathies often present after prolonged periods of rest. Attacks can range from profound muscle weakness to total paralysis. Sleep is the most frequent form of rest to evoke episodes; patients literally may not be able to get out of bed.
     
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  7. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Keep pushing med ed!!!
     
  8. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks, needed a laugh today!
     
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  9. BruceInOz

    BruceInOz Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    A reset doesn't need to be that drastic. A decent sized asteroid impact seemed to do the trick with the dinosaurs 65 million years ago. Unless of course the problems are due to evolutionary baggage we're still carrying from the Cambrian explosion.
     
  10. Wonko

    Wonko Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I suspect the 'evolutionary baggage' dates back to the birth of the universe, if such a thing actually occurred (i.e. the BPS movement is a natural consequence of the way people think, and the way people think is a consequence of evolution, and evolution is a consequence of the way the universe works), but I can think of no easy way of producing (or undoing) a 'big bang' event in my kitchen, so.....the next easiest and cheapest alternative would have to do. I know it's selfish, it leaves everything else in the universe to suffer it's own fate, but we, as a species are very inventive, and determined, when it comes to methods of destroying things, and ourselves, surely a little matter of figuring out......lol
     
  11. Peter Trewhitt

    Peter Trewhitt Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    This is sounding a bit like the idea of 'original sin' dating back to the fall of Adam and Eve.
     
  12. James Morris-Lent

    James Morris-Lent Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    @Cinders66
    I'm not an expert but I'm aware that it's common for people with major depression to suffer from symptoms like:
    -slowed thinking and movement ("psychomotor slowing"),
    -heavy-feeling limbs ("leaden paralysis"),
    -excessive sleeping ("hypersomnia").

    Or people can become catatonic and perhaps be mostly incapable of movement.

    The clear takeaway is that Major Depression is much more than chronic sad mood and low motivation - these are just typical 'emotional' manifestations of the disease. The brain can start really messing up and that can make it hard for sufferers to even move, regardless of how 'motivatedly' they attempt to perform some action. (I don't know enough to tell you exactly what is going on neurologically to produce these symptoms but they are apparently typical.)

    ___

    I will confirm that these articles are stupid.
     
  13. Mithriel

    Mithriel Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Finding it hard to move in the morning is a classic sign of arthritis, probably because the joints seize up after lying down for so long.

    Change may not be so hard as you think. I was involved in the fight to get sexual abuse acknowledged in the 80s. All the literature of the time (from psychologists!) was unsympathetic to the children, well to everyone except the men involved really. It made me grind my teeth. Newspapers would not print anything, very few people were arrested and even less were found guilty. If charges were brought they were often seen as a teenage girl becoming jealous because she had lost the attention.

    It still makes me grind my teeth thinking about some of what was written. The feminist movement fought it and it took about a few years but there was a sudden change in attitudes. I think it is called a phase change in science.
     
  14. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yes, a lot of pushing and finally, finally it moves. And then it gains momentum.
     
  15. Forbin

    Forbin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    [And seems to cause psych majors to leave uncorrected typos in four-year-old articles.]
    I imagine it's especially unlikely since neither "Dysania" nor "Clinomania" are listed in either the DSM or the ICD.

    On the other hand, neither is "Drapetomania" - the 19th century "mental illness" that caused African slaves to run away from their plantations.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2018
  16. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I have used the iceberg analogy previously. At first it is huge, monolithic, and most of it is unseen. Then it melts a bit, but it still seems monolithic. Finally it breaks up and starts melting rapidly.

    While change can come from major events, usually labelled catastrophic if its a natural phenomenon, lots of change occurs by the cumulative impact of many small events.

    For us that can be as simple as doing a tiny bit toward advocacy, or making a tiny donation to medical research. Our effort is tiny, individually, but huge, collectively.
     
  17. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    But none of us would survive that. :nailbiting:

    Ah, that is why none of the online medical dictionaries could tell me what "Dysania" is. :rolleyes:
     
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