1. Guest, read our 'News in Brief' post for w/c 13th Jan by clicking here.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Welcome! To read the Core Purpose and Values of our forum, click here.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Show your support for the proposed GWAS research, for details click here.
    Dismiss Notice

Denmark: Interview with Per Fink in Dagens Medicin

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS News' started by Kalliope, Sep 9, 2019.

  1. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,515
    Likes Received:
    25,714
    Location:
    Norway
    The Danish medical newspaper Dagens Medisin has had a seminar about health where psychiatrist Per Fink was invited.

    He talks about how he's been attacked and harassed by patients, and even had a senator speaking against him. His clinic has hired help from a communication agency, the staff has received media training and they've just hired a combined physician and journalist to engage in dialogue with the most critical patients and patient organisations.

    When asked whether they've been good enough at involving politicians he says they haven't and that it's problematic that the Parliament listens more to those with rabid meanings than to the profession.

    Dagens Medicin: Professor i funktionelle lidelser: Patienter kan ikke selv bestemme, hvad de fejler
    google translation: Professor in functional disorders: the patients can't decide for themselves what's wrong with them
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2019
  2. John Mac

    John Mac Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    205
    Likes Received:
    2,463
    Hiring a communication company, staff receiving media training, hiring a physician/journalist, it just sums them up really, nothing to do with helping patients, just helping themselves.
     
  3. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,515
    Likes Received:
    25,714
    Location:
    Norway
    Here is the program for the seminar (in Danish).
    The section where Per Fink spoke was titled How to build bridges
    Director Anne Kaltoft, Heart Association and professor Per Fink, Research clinic for functional disorders, about communicating with the sceptics
     
    alktipping, Joh, ScottTriGuy and 2 others like this.
  4. strategist

    strategist Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,282
    Likes Received:
    22,364
    None of this will turn bad science into good one.

    Also, does this mean we should be expecting a journalist to visit this forum? :D
     
  5. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    6,067
    Likes Received:
    61,484
    Could someone suggest he/she engages in dialogue with me? I am not a patient or patient organisation but I am critical!
     
  6. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,515
    Likes Received:
    25,714
    Location:
    Norway
    I assume that would be press officer Lene Toscano, senior doctor and journalist
    email: lenesanc@rm.dk
    Source: http://funktionellelidelser.dk/kontakt/
     
  7. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    3,070
    Likes Received:
    23,428
    Location:
    Canada
    Correct, things would be even worse if it wasn't for people pushing back against this ridiculous pseudoscience. We are well aware of this, it's the same damn problem everywhere.

    Still not one bit of reliable evidence that "functional disorders" as Fink describes them are even a thing. PR won't fix that. Everything else is science doing its thing and countering nonsense.

    Does he see himself in Wakefield? I bet he doesn't see the obvious parallels. The biggest worry is how this guy has any support. Quacks are a dime a dozen. How is it that otherwise serious institutions are enabling this crap? Fink is seriously unstable, he shouldn't have medical authority over vulnerable people, letting him have free rein is incredibly reckless and irresponsible.
     
    Annamaria, MEMarge, TiredSam and 7 others like this.
  8. Barry

    Barry Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    5,255
    Likes Received:
    34,309
    It's very telling that these people don't try to defend their indefensible science, and instead put so much effort into smear-campaigning those legitimately criticising their science.
     
  9. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    6,067
    Likes Received:
    61,484
    epipnoia, MEMarge, TiredSam and 38 others like this.
  10. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,515
    Likes Received:
    25,714
    Location:
    Norway
    I'm sure that would be greatly appreciated! Don't have a good overview of who is who in Denmark, but will try to pass it on. Thank you!
     
  11. strategist

    strategist Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,282
    Likes Received:
    22,364
    There is the Danish ME Foreningen. I have no idea if they are competent but they seem at least a little bit organized. https://me-foreningen.dk/
     
  12. Snowdrop

    Snowdrop Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,117
    Likes Received:
    7,176
    They don't need a journalist they need Rumpelstiltskin. In this case he'd have to spin horse manure into gold though.
     
  13. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,515
    Likes Received:
    25,714
    Location:
    Norway
    Jonathan Edwards has joined the ME debate in Norway a couple of times, and I believe it has played an important role. One thing is that his inputs of course have been valuable and knowledgable in themselves. But having someone of his academic calibre supporting the patient's side matters even more when the debate is misrepresented as a dispute between patients and "the professionals". I'd be very happy to see such an alley to Danish patients.
     
  14. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,515
    Likes Received:
    25,714
    Location:
    Norway
  15. MEinDenmark

    MEinDenmark New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    54
    Here is an example of Lene Toscano's work in 2012. In 2013, she received 3.3 million kroner from the insurance company, Tryg, to convince people to believe in the concepts of Bodily Distress Syndrome and Funktionelle Lidelser. She might be a journalist, but she bought and paid for by Fink.
    http://funktionellelidelser.dk/file...dk/patient_Pjecer/When_the_body_says_stop.pdf
     
  16. Forbin

    Forbin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    942
    Likes Received:
    6,908
    The old "This food is terrible - and such small portions!" defense.
     
    MEMarge, TiredSam, Annamaria and 5 others like this.
  17. MEinDenmark

    MEinDenmark New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    54
    Dr. Edwards, Rebecca Hansen here, I would be very pleased to talk to you about representing the Danish ME Association. I have been the chairman since 2010.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 9, 2019
  18. Barry

    Barry Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    5,255
    Likes Received:
    34,309
    Excellent!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 10, 2019
  19. strategist

    strategist Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,282
    Likes Received:
    22,364
    Reading this I get the suspicion that his functional disorder is designed to capture the POTS and small fibre neuropathy phenotype in particular. And of course anything that's unexplained.

    His functional disorder is presented essentially as the brain perceiving symptoms of illness where there isn't actually an illness. A problem mainly of perception. Although they also say that the body isn't working correctly either but don't explain what they mean.

    It is a very dangerous diagnosis and way of interpreting reality.
     
  20. Marky

    Marky Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    253
    Likes Received:
    1,858
    Location:
    Norway
    I have so much to say about this stupid functional disorder construct, but it feels like a waste of time dissecting something that`s made up

    Go get em Jonathan!
     

Share This Page