BPS attempts at psychologizing Long Covid

Kitty said:
We can live in hope and die in despair! – as my mother used to say, rolling her eyes.

But Katharine Cheston, whom I've not come across before, did a pretty good job of demolishing the absurdities in article on Twitter. It won't dent the Observer's tendency to smugness about being on the right side of every argument, but it made me feel better.
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The author is displaying about the same level of listening skills to the responses as whatever reading skills she put into the last part of the article. She mentions at some point she has been looking for years at the evidence. Which is just sad, all things considered. It's one thing to put out nonsense, it's a whole other thing to put effort into it.
 
Jonathan Edwards said:
ME Association

@MEAssociation
·
5h

.
@eleanormorgan
Long read but, if you're up for it, well worth the effort - 'Long Covid: ‘Is this now me forever?’' | The Observer, 29 November, 2020: https://theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/29/eleanor-morgan-is-still-struggling-with-long-covid-months-after-catching-the-virus… #longcovid #longhaulers #mecfs #cfsme #MyalgicE #pwme

Why is the MEA recommending this ill-informed muddle?
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The GP quoted in this article, Tomlinson, is also quoted here as saying "[t]here is no one for whom the problem of chronic pain is not a symptom of complex trauma."

Such views would be laughable if they were not so deeply damaging.
 
Nightsong said:
The GP quoted in this article, Tomlinson, is also quoted here as saying "[t]here is no one for whom the problem of chronic pain is not a symptom of complex trauma."

Such views would be laughable if they were not so deeply damaging.
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That is an interesting video. Dr Tomlinson looks to be suffering from some fairly serious psychopathology - may be childhood trauma, or maybe something more real.

For a journalist to quote someone whose body language so clearly exudes nonsense is a serious failing.
 
Nightsong said:
The GP quoted in this article, Tomlinson, is also quoted here as saying "[t]here is no one for whom the problem of chronic pain is not a symptom of complex trauma."

Such views would be laughable if they were not so deeply damaging.
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At least he openly says what he believes. This limits the harm somewhat. Compare to the PACE authors who are clever and always say to journalists that they don't know why patients object to CBT when it's only an attempt to help them cope with illness.
 
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https://twitter.com/MaryClayton13/status/1333088969102397443



I don't understand Tomlinson's replies to MaryClayton13. He doesn't make it clear whether he thinks endometriosis, lupus, rheumatoid arthritis or Ehlers Danlos syndrome actually exist? Or they are caused by childhood trauma? Or they don't cause physical trauma? Or they don't leave any legacy of trauma?

What exactly is he trying to get at here? Because it isn't clear (to me) what he thinks or means at all.
 
I've read Tomlinson's tweets over a number of years. I don't think he has a bad heart, but as a GP he is a longstanding member of a Balint group where GPs get together regularly for group therapy to discuss their feelings about their patients and the experience of being a doctor from a psychotherapeutic perspective.

It seems to me that the psychological perspective gives him a sense of mastery/power in a consultation because he can "explain" unexplained symptoms. He works in a deprived East End practice where socioeconomic factors are prevalent in consultations and he seems to think that "ACE" (adverse childhood experiences) can account for lots of the symptoms that patients with chronic conditions report.

For young healthy, fitness freak guys like him, it must be hard to understand that your body can get damaged by chronic disease or pathogens and that medical treatments don't necessarily ameliorate all your symptoms. His problem is lack of personal experience as his biggest health complaint seems to be occasional accidents on his bike where he fractures a limb. He doesn't really understand what chronic disease involves on an experiential level.
 
Trial By Error: The Observer Slips Up; ME Association Responds
News organizations continue to misrepresent ME (and its various iterations) in their coverage of what has come to be called long-Covid. A current UK example is Sunday’s Observer article by writer Eleanor Morgan, who is experiencing prolonged symptoms since falling ill last spring. (It’s on The Guardian site; the two organizations are linked in some way.) Here’s Morgan’s bio on the website for the literary journal Granta, to which she has also contributed: “Eleanor Morgan is a writer based in London. Her latest book, Hormonal: A Conversation About Women’s Bodies, Mental Health and Why We Need to Be Heard (Virago) is out now. She is also training as a psychologist.”

Much of Morgan’s Observer article is a well-written, sympathetic and informative account of how she and various others are coping with their health challenges and the accompanying emotional roller-coaster. Then the article tackles the possible relationship between long-Covid and what it refers to as chronic fatigue syndrome. That’s when it takes a wrong turn.
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https://www.virology.ws/2020/11/29/trial-by-error-the-observer-slips-up-me-association-responds/
 
Mij said:
This is Dr. Jonathon Tomlinson on Twitter.

He's really big on the anxiety angle of everything it seems.
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What a quack.

Unfortunately his views would be shared by the majority of doctors here in Australia. Perhaps more importantly, those few medical professionals who would disagree with him generally lack the courage to publicly call out this sort of quackery.

Doctors like this are a danger to patients and need to banned. Can complaints can be made about him to the UK medical authorities?
 
JamBob said:
For young healthy, fitness freak guys like him, it must be hard to understand that your body can get damaged by chronic disease or pathogens and that medical treatments don't necessarily ameliorate all your symptoms. His problem is lack of personal experience as his biggest health complaint seems to be occasional accidents on his bike where he fractures a limb. He doesn't really understand what chronic disease involves on an experiential level.
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It seems that doctors have become social-media 'influencers' now? I mean, where is his responsibility as a physician about using his platform to spread his ignorance and misinformation?
 
Arnie Pye said:


I don't understand Tomlinson's replies to MaryClayton13. He doesn't make it clear whether he thinks endometriosis, lupus, rheumatoid arthritis or Ehlers Danlos syndrome actually exist? Or they are caused by childhood trauma? Or they don't cause physical trauma? Or they don't leave any legacy of trauma?

What exactly is he trying to get at here? Because it isn't clear (to me) what he thinks or means at all.
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We have to remind ourselves that medical doctors are generally not scientists or other researchers. Just because they have “Dr.” before their name doesn’t mean they know anything or have any idea what they are talking about.

Like what is this garbage he wrote?
toxic stress affects the developing neuro/endocrine/immune and other systems, so it's biological/physiological which is why autoimmune diseases are much more prevalent in people who have experienced developmental trauma
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Where’s the references from the literature? Where’s the evidence? It’s just made up smart sounding verbal diarrhea.

Medical school doesn’t train most doctors to have the critical thinking skills and training of a researcher. The problem is that many people just listen to them because they automatically think they must be smart because they are a doctor.

How many stupid and ignorant doctors have we all had to suffer through? That even went to amazing medical schools? Tons.
 
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leokitten said:
We have to remind ourselves that medical doctors are generally not scientists or other researchers. Just because they have. “Dr.” before their name doesn’t mean they know anything or have any idea what they are talking about.

Like what is this garbage he wrote?
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I think the garbage shows that this is more than just ignorance. This is arrogant hamfisted evangelical busy-bodying of a very nasty sort. Despite what @JamBob says, I actually think this shows a bad heart; imposing your self-righteousness on others is bad. The journalist should be ashamed to have quoted this and may need to ask herself whether she is in the same boat. The Guardian editor in chief, as Frances Ryan implies, needs to ask herself some questions about what her paper is about. I actually think that one of the main reasons people vote for people the Guardian hate is because the people the Guardian fawn over aren't always the perfect rational compassionate beings they think they are. Life is more complicated than the colour of a banner.
 
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