BBC: I made a film from my bed to prove my illness is real - Jen brea

Hate to be the Danny-downer here...

While it is a great review, especially coming from the BBC, and truly a GREAT documentary, the picture of Jen and her husband in bed (about halfway down the page) looks almost like an photo one would see in 'House Beautiful' or dare I say, Oprah's 'O' magazine.

Too posed, too relaxed, and almost too "glamorous"...like they're in some ad for a high-end hotel. No doubt the producers suggested they needed that kind of image to get pull the public in, but it does us a disservice in that it may send the wrong message if one just glances at the article without reading the details.
 
I didn't really see it that way @dannybex. OK, so maybe it is a bit posed and artificial, but to me - and many others I think - it is more a statement, telling a story in a picture, than intending to be taken 100% literal. Just getting across that they are a fairly young, loving couple, whose lives are thoroughly messed up on every level by ME and society's attitude to PwME. You, as an ME sufferer, are on the inside looking out. The film, and these articles on it, are aimed at the people on the outside looking in; as a person who does not have ME (my wife does), I believe they are the people who most need to be educated.
 
I hear what you're saying @Barry and agree in general, but I guess for me, it reminds me of the "But you don't look sick!" criticisms we get from friends, family members, etc., especially when compared to the scene in the film when Jen is convulsing on the ground as her husband struggles to help her. That to me, is a far more powerful and impactful image than the posed one, where, IMO their lives don't look too 'messed up'.
 
I liked it except for this bit:
"Fundamentally what I get from our relationship is her company," says Wasow. "The fact that her mind is as sharp and vibrant and interesting as it was when I first met her means that I still feel quite lucky."

Brea feels lucky too, even though there are days where her mind feels far from sharp. But she points out that it is still seen as exceptional for a man to stay and look after a woman.

"If he were sick and I had stayed to care for him, I don't think people would look at me as a hero," she says.
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I remain to be convinced there is a gender difference in terms the percentages of male and female partners who leave or stay around.

I remember looking at the membership list of a group I helped run. It had around 400 members. I didn't know the circumstances of all of them but did for a lot of them. When I totted up the figures, the percentages where a relationship had ended was pretty much exactly the same (to within one percentage point)
 
Dolphin said:
I remain to be convinced there is a gender difference in terms the percentages of male and female partners who leave or stay around.
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I remember reading some study which seemed to indicate that women were more likely to be abandoned. Can't remember to details now, but google found this Time article: http://time.com/83486/divorce-is-more-likely-if-the-wife-not-the-husband-gets-sick/

There's this older paper [edit: on cancer patients]:

Women composed 53% of the patient population. Divorce or separation occurred at a rate similar to that reported in the literature (11.6%). There was, however, a greater than 6-fold increase in risk after diagnosis when the affected spouse was the woman (20.8% vs 2.9%; P < .001).
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http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/cncr.24577/abstract

The figures might be different for something like 'CFS', which brings so many of its own prejudices and challenges. I've certainly heard some horror stories about how both female and male partners have responded.
 
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Esther12 said:
I remember reading some study which seemed to indicate that women were more likely to be abandoned. Can't remember to details now, but google found this Time article: http://time.com/83486/divorce-is-more-likely-if-the-wife-not-the-husband-gets-sick/

There's this older paper:



http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/cncr.24577/abstract

The figures might be different for something like 'CFS', which brings so many of its own prejudices and challenges. I've certainly heard some horror stories about how both female and male partners have responded.
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It also makes you wonder how much of that abandonment could be due to the supposed professionals/experts convincing people that it must be "all in their partner's head", and not really wanting to get better. Professional medical advice is a very potent influence, because an average person typically cannot imagine it to be wrong when stated with such "knowledgeable" assertiveness.
 
Barry said:
It also makes you wonder how much of that abandonment could be due to the supposed professionals/experts convincing people that it must be "all in their partner's head", and not really wanting to get better. Professional medical advice is a very potent influence, because an average person typically cannot imagine it to be wrong when stated with such "knowledgeable" assertiveness.
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I didn't make it clear, but those figures were from a study on cancer patients. I haven't seen anything specifically on CFS, but I've heard from a lot of people about how the biopsychosocial stuff has led to problems in their relationships.
 
I would add that there would be a problem with extrapolating social data from the US and applying it to different cultures.

There is the whole area of social safety net and medical costs difference to most other European cultures.
I would predict that this alone would magnify any effects found, similar to if there was a study about unemployment instead of illness.
 
Dolphin said:
I remain to be convinced there is a gender difference in terms the percentages of male and female partners who leave or stay around.
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I have no idea what the proportions are of genders of partners who leave when their partners become chronically ill.

The point I thought Jen was making was not the behaviour of the spouses, but the attitudes of other people to those who stay in a relationship and care for their sick partners.

I thought she made a good point that if a woman looks after a sick husband, that is often seen as unremarkable, but if a man looks after a sick wife, he is a hero.

I think it's an extension of the idea that if a man does housework or child care, he's helping his wife and therefore praiseworthy, if a woman does it, it's normal and unremarkable.

Of course all this is a huge generalisation, probably coloured by my experience which is not relevant to this discussion.
 
Here's a study with the numbers, percentages, and gender of carers.(UK) Table 1 shows the numbers.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2524.2008.00826.x/full#t2n3

Table 1

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I agree, provided we add unpaid labour before descriptions of caring in the context of caring and "work" :)

I'm just in an argumentative mood, and the quote from Jen rubbed me up the wrong way, both for personal reasons, and the fact I know of quite a few carers of both genders who are socially isolated, treated with contempt and ignorance by the DWP, and generally ignored by society.

Respite care, provision and support has been severely cut in my area, and there has been little comment from media or the general public, and it frustrates me.

An offer of a cup of tea and a chat isn't enough for all these people, of either gender or circumstance.

I noticed that even the census doesn't seem to collect data for carers under the age of 16, which is even more frustrating.
 
Luther Blissett said:
I'm just in an argumentative mood, and the quote from Jen rubbed me up the wrong way, both for personal reasons, and the fact I know of quite a few carers of both genders who are socially isolated, treated with contempt and ignorance by the DWP, and generally ignored by society.
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That's certainly true, and I don't think we should get too sidetracked by gender ratios.

The only acknowledgement that I've been sole carer for my daughter for 20 years while being sick myself was my GP saying to me recently, I suppose I should put you down in your notes as a carer.

There followed an invitation to me to attend a 'carer's meeting'. Cue hollow laugh from this housebound carer! I am lucky to have a few friends and a couple of family members who still visit occasionally, and PIP that pays for the physical help we need.

There are huge numbers of unsupported lonely carers, and huge numbers with no-one to care for them. My heart goes out to all such folk.
 
Trish said:
I have no idea what the proportions are of genders of partners who leave when their partners become chronically ill.

The point I thought Jen was making was not the behaviour of the spouses, but the attitudes of other people to those who stay in a relationship and care for their sick partners.

I thought she made a good point that if a woman looks after a sick husband, that is often seen as unremarkable, but if a man looks after a sick wife, he is a hero.

I think it's an extension of the idea that if a man does housework or child care, he's helping his wife and therefore praiseworthy, if a woman does it, it's normal and unremarkable.

Of course all this is a huge generalisation, probably coloured by my experience which is not relevant to this discussion.
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I do agree with that. A woman is still stereotyped in a way that looking after a sick husband is seen as "part of the role", more so than if the roles are reversed.
 
It may depend how things are defined. I think there might be at least as much if not more sympathy on average if a woman had to become the sole bread-winner for a family if a husband/male partner became unable to work than if the genders are reversed where a man might be more expected to take on that role.
 
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That's a good point, @Dolphin, I bet there are a lot of men who can't work because of ME who are supported by wives, partners or parents who face criticism for not fulfilling their 'male role' as breadwinner. We (edit- I mean society in general, not us in particular) really do need to get past these gendered judgements in both directions.
 
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