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The benefits of Qigong exercise for symptoms of fatigue A protocol for systematic review and meta-analysis, Wang et al, 2021

Discussion in 'Alternative Therapies' started by Andy, Feb 7, 2021.

  1. Andy

    Andy Committee Member & Outreach

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    Open access, https://journals.lww.com/md-journal...ts_of_Qigong_exercise_for_symptoms_of.66.aspx
     
  2. cassava7

    cassava7 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    An assumption from the authors before they even begin their review. Much like other "calm" exercises such as yoga, it's safe only for ME patients for whom it doesn't trigger PEM -- at best mildly severe ones. I don't know whether there have been studies of Qigong for CFS, but if so I suppose that the participants were not well characterized (Oxford or Fukuda) and we will know neither if they have PEM nor their severity.

    I hope that in the subgroup analyses, they look at the efficacy of Qigong vs. psychotherapies and/or other forms of exercise. My bet is that it wouldn't be superior, and that like these other therapies, it doesn't do much but maximizing the placebo effect.

    Considering that the review will look at treatable diseases like cancer, how can the effects of Qigong be separately identified from those of the treatments? If they are small, I'm not sure this is possible, and this would be even more difficult with longer courses of Qigong. The same goes with a natural improvement of the condition, if there is one (e.g. remitting post-viral fatigue), and regression to the mean.

    I hope the reviewers will not spin their results if they're not positive.
     
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  3. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    Given this type of exercise normally involves standing I wonder if the researchers have given any consideration to orthostatic intolerance.
     
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  4. Mij

    Mij Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    In the early 90's my support group suggested trying Qigong, it benefited the FM group but not those of us with CFS.

    I didn't have OI during that time and found Qigong very exhausting.
     
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  5. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Honestly the degree of misunderstanding of what fatigue means is pretty much at the level of doing a report on youth in Asia instead of euthanasia. It basically means nothing at this point. Simply not talking about the same thing.
     
  6. Invisible Woman

    Invisible Woman Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    When I was practising yoga and learning about different breathing exercises some of them wiped me out very fast.

    I knew some other people with mild ME who also practised yoga & had tried Qigong and most found too much.

    Yep. I can't understand why they can't understand that. It's like two patients going to see a doctor and getting the same treatment for pain when one can lead a normal life and the other can't move, one has crippling migraine and tge other's left big toe aches in damp weather. :rolleyes:

    Not all pain is the same, not all fatigue is the same.

    That's before you even consider that some pwME don't consider fatigue to be they're most debilitating symptom.

    It's like that joke about a person stopping someone to ask directions to be told "well, I wouldn't start from here!"
     
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  7. Binkie4

    Binkie4 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I did a tai chi class for 10 years which began with 20 minutes Qigong, and the instructor occasionally gave over the whole session to Qigong. I also practiced at home. I did feel well and stimulated by the practice, both physically and cognitively.

    It was before my ME diagnosis but while loving tai chi, and learning and practicing the form, I always found Qigong very hard. The standing still exhausted me. I was diagnosed in 2008 and by 2009 had to give up tai chi to my regret. I have never had a diagnosis of Orthostatic intolerance but since I can now barely be upright for a minute or two, am sure I have it. Not sure how this will affect the research findings.
     
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  8. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    I have been to a couple of sessions yoga class organised through a local ME group. I could manage the stretches lying down but kneeling etc were too difficult. a good 1/3 of the hour was a lying down with lights dimmed guided meditation this was a lot more feasible than anything involving standing up.

    I believe that adapted seated tai chi classes are possible but my memory of a few tai chi sessions when I was in my 30s was that the moves looked gentle but were nevertheless demanding on muscles as well as requiring good balance.
     

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