Myalgia and CFS following immunization: macrophagic myofasciitis and animal studies support linkage to aluminum adjuvant persistency, 2019, Gheradi

Discussion in 'ME/CFS research' started by Andy, May 7, 2019.

  1. Andy

    Andy Committee Member

    Hampshire, UK
    Sci Hub,
  2. Hoopoe

    Hoopoe Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    That would fit with my case. Before a more definite onset, there was a prodromal phase lasting a few years with occasional weird symptoms, and that began approximately at the time I was given hepatitis B immunizations. It was 20 years ago so I don't remember the details unfortunately.
  3. Amw66

    Amw66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    I think it may be " in the mix" I have a client who had tetanus jag just prior to onset, my aunt had multiple vaccinations for travel, and there are many girls with ME and or/POTS following HPV- which has a high adjuvent load.
    DokaGirl, Starlight and andypants like this.
  4. Eagles

    Eagles Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Very interesting, thank you. My illness started after Hepatitis B vaccinations.
    JaneL, DokaGirl and Starlight like this.
  5. MSEsperanza

    MSEsperanza Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    betwixt and between
    Hm, I find the abstract very confusing. I understood the paper's authors (or other researchers?) first tested their hypothesis on small animals? These studies have revolutionized the knowledge about aluminium toxicology (or toxicity?) in general?

    Now they have tested their hypothesis on sheep. This confirms the previous revoulutionary findings and adds evidence to the applicability of their rmodel to other large animals like humans?

    Does the WHO page on vaccine safety now need a substantial update?

    Last edited: May 7, 2019
  6. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    There are ongoing concerns about metals, including aluminum causing disruption in health.

    I believe this is justified in at least general terms given evidence metals such as lead and mercury have been proven to cause health problems.

    The question of aluminum has been noted before in threads:

    Why oh why do manufacturers need to put questionable substances in health products?

    I'm not an anti-vaccer.

    But, I am concerned about the metals in health products.

    I've had about a decade of allergy injections - the old style ones, apparently with aluminum in them.

    And, many teeth heavily filled with amalgam fillings.

    Amalgam is approximately 50% mercury.

    As well, due to GI problems before ME, and much worsened with ME, I used a great deal of antacids, which contained aluminum.

    (I finally found the non-aluminum kind of antacid.)

    Antiperspirants did, or do contain aluminum.

    And, of course, there is aluminum cookware.

    Animal studies proved dental mercury escapes into the tissues in short order, and is not bound up with other metals as the dental industry claims.

    Health Canada has info on its website about this issue.
    This Ministry takes a balanced approach, but confirms mercury escapes from dental fillings:

    "3. Mercury release from amalgam and its absorption by the body

    Mercury is released from amalgam in several ways."

    Here is the link to the Health Canada website:

    The dental industry claims the mercury in fillings is insignificant.

    Maybe so, however, it's the accumulation from many sources that is possibly the problem (seafood, air, water, soil etc.)

    Likewise, I would guess other industries who add questionable or toxic metals such as aluminum to products provide similar excuses.

    This excuse giving is involved in climate change issues and lack of progress; small countries who defend their pollution output by saying they're just a little guy, their contribution to the problem is insignificant.

    This reasoning is short-sighted. The pollution adds up - it accumulates, as apparently do heavy metals.

    I understand flu vaccines used to contain mercury, aluminum, and formaldehyde. And, as above, allergy injections used to contain aluminum.

    Vaccines in general used to contain thimersol, a form of mercury.

    Water, soil and air all house heavy metals, and aluminum, which is not, I believe classified as a heavy metal.

    I wonder about our world travelers with ME.

    Did the multiple vaccinations for travel tip them over the edge into ME?
    andypants likes this.
  7. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    London, UK
    I think not. As far as I can see the paper provides no evidence for anything much.
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  8. Londinium

    Londinium Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    I treat vaccine claims with a massive amount of scepticism and believe that, given the significant potential and actual harm that can come from making unfounded claims about vaccines, any such claims had better be watertight.

    I don’t think the above study meets such a requirement.
    JaneL, andypants, oldtimer and 7 others like this.
  9. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Considering the indifference and misinformation of the most basic aspects of ME within medicine, if it did play a role none of the existing research on vaccine safety would have found a link yet, not even by accident.

    I doubt there is, but none of the existing research has falsified this possibility. Same with blood transfusions, since we do not know if the effect is sustained and can affect a transfused person, we are just wholly in the dark on both counts. However the costs of doing that research means it won't happen so if there is a link, we'd only know years from now by correlating and then properly testing.
    chrisb and DokaGirl like this.
  10. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Is anyone else having trouble with the scihub link?
  11. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    @rvallee, your mention of blood tranfusions reminds me that pwME and "cfs" are, as you know, disallowed from giving blood in some countries including Canada: - to see the Blood Services comment on CFS, you need to scroll down a ways on this link - Canadian blood services defers donations from people with a history of CFS "out of a concern for their health".

    The concern bit for our health seems new.

    I think it used to just say we can't donate blood.

    Funny, there seems little if any concern for the health of pwME elsewhere.

    Which part of our "health" are they talking about? Mental or physical health?

    I've never heard of a whole community being banned from giving blood due to concerns about their mental health.

    Could it be they are concerned for our physical health? :wtf:

    Such is the schizophrenic treatment of ME.
    andypants and rvallee like this.

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