A 4-day mindfulness-based cognitive behavioural intervention program for CFS/ME. An open study, with one-year follow-up, 2018, Stubhaug et al

Here's a weird one:
A 4-day mindfulness-based cognitive behavioural intervention program for CFS/ME. An open study, with one-year follow-up.
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyt.2018.00720/abstract

These people seem to be implying that four days of CBT will fix your "CFS/ME" permanently, showing continued improvement at one year follow-up.

Oxford of course. And all subjective surveys, of course. But man! Can you imagine telling someone they had a major psychiatric disorder but that four days of therapy would cure them permanently?

 

oh dear..
Bjarte Stubhaug is a psychiatrist with a doctorate on chronic fatigue syndrome or "neurasthenia", which is the same according to him. He runs a resort in Norway with a four-day treatment plan including mindfullness, walks and classes. He doesn't distinguish ME from stress, burnout etc. I've heard numerous accounts of ME patients deteriorate after treatment at his resort.

I think he was at a conference about CFS at Cook Islands quite a few years back where also some PACE-researchers participated.. But can't find the conference when googling..

He has published lots of articles about ME and done a lot of damage in general by spreading "facts" about ME as a stress disorder.

He's developed an expensive app about stress and mindfulness. I'm sure many here will be disappointed to learn its only available in Norwegian..

 

Very reassuring though to read they've used the criteria from the PACE study for inclusion..

 

Oh wow. Patients were selected using the Oxford criteria, improvement criteria from the PACE trial were used with only subjective outcomes and there was no control condition whatsoever.

I really hope this is a hoax uncovering the nonsense in ME/CFS research.

 

I'm sure that has been discussed on a thread some time ago. Perhaps someone will remember which.

 

He runs a four-day retreat?

Wow, it suddenly all makes sense.

Which journal published this drivel? Frontiers?!

It's 'provisionally accepted'... someone publish a comment for heaven's sake.

 

This is why I made the comment about the Frontiers journals a few weeks back. A lot of ME/CFS studies end up there, and I don't think it's a good thing.

 

There was a thread in another place in another universe. The commercial friends of BPS were there - maybe organised it. There used to be a webpage showing familiar faces and glasses of beer but I guess it has probably been taken down.

 

I guess this is about Stubbhaugs program/centre, but note the name Gerd Kvale also.

Gerd Kvale is a professor in psycology (at Haukeland university hospital, the home of Fluge/Mella), leading the OCD team. She is one of the two persons who developed the "Bergen 4 day treatment" (B4DT) - "get rid of your anxity in four days"

https://helse-bergen.no/klinikk-for-4-dagers-behandling-b4dt


Innovation of the year
The CTF was awarded “Innovation of the year” by The Norwegian Psychological Science Association in 2015. The CTF is highly requested by patients, families and therapists, both nationwide as well as internationally, not only for OCD but for other anxiety disorders as well as for depression

https://helse-bergen.no/klinikk-for-4-dagers-behandling-b4dt/the-bergen-4-day-treatment

 

This program has no chance of succeeding it takes four days to do what LP can do in three.

 

Sigh. This is the problem with assuming that a questionnaire is actual evidence of improvement after an unblinded intervention.

These interventions may be effective at changing cognitions with respect to how patients report symptoms, but this is not the same thing as objective improvements in their lives. Specifically achieving the human needs that were previously unfullfilled due to the illness. There is a fundamental lack of quality in how we assess the impact of interventions like this.

 

Ah. Of course. It's 4 A's, not 3. Better check with 5 just to be sure but 4 seems to be the right amount.

So it's pronounced Leviosaaaa after all, in Norwegian anyway. Now let's fund 40 more identical replications of the same trial that all conclude that more research is needed and that should secure a couple decades of employment doing the equivalent of shoveling rain during a huge storm.

This has always really just been an employment scheme for mediocre physicians, has it? Just stuff those trials with people randomly snatched from the street for all they care.

 

I'm in no way defending this work on ME or disagree with you on the lack of quality.

More concerned that Gerd Kvale is connected to this research, as the B4DT is so well applauded over here, making it harder to criticice the "ME"-study :-/ Also the implication that ME is more or less the same as OCD and anxiety. Don't know how the quality of the B4DT study is, but the media coverage seems nothing but positive. Again, making it harder for ME-patients to criticise a similare approach for our illness - we are already heavily criticed for arguing against LP, CBT etc :-/

The Kavli trust, that also fund Fluge/Mella also funds the establishing of several B4DT centers for children/youth in Norway. The link also contains short description of each treatement day.

https://kavlifondet.no/2017/03/lar-angsten-slippe-taket/

 

Yeah... :-/ we have our very own flavour of the BPS-cult over here....

 

Ah hah! I bought into this in my early days and went ahead, had a 2 days silent mindfulnes workshop. I left the place slightly peaceful and content, remembering coming back home when I turn the corner to our street I saw my sister in law's car. I thought fuck! 2 days of peace and silence gonna be wasted in probably 10 minutes and I was right.

So, never mind sorting you for life 10 minutes it took me to get dizzied with verbal diahorrea and back to the usual tiredness.

 

Here is the full paper. I'd appreciate hearing your thoughts about it, it's already being pushed here by the psychosomatic-brigade.

Frontiers in Psychiatry: A 4-Day Mindfulness-Based Cognitive Behavioural Intervention Program for CFS/ME. An Open Study, With 1-year Follow-Up

 

Unblinded clinical intervention relying on subjective outcomes and no comparison group = evidence that cannot be generalised.

Most statisticians chuckle when reading things like this. I can't (quickly) figure out who performed the statistical analysis on that study though.
https://mchankins.wordpress.com/201...y-a-bad-idea-for-proms-data-a-worked-example/