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A thread for those concerned about weight gain

Discussion in 'Lifestyle Management' started by Woolie, Oct 17, 2017.

  1. Dechi

    Dechi Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yes, meals without protein are digested too fast. I am sure if you waited a while you’d stop being hungry at night. Your stomach would shrink and hunger would not be felt. But it truly is unpleasant while it’s taking place and we do need our sleep. So eat if you have to !
     
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  2. TigerLilea

    TigerLilea Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    You can't make the assumption that all skinny people must be anorexic. My nieces are always getting called that and they have healthy appetites. The one niece ate McDonalds food twice a day for three months hoping to put on weight. She failed. Her sister was thrilled when she was finally able to put on 10 lbs. When I was younger I could eat a couple of Big Macs, a side of fries, an apple pie, and a pop and I wouldn't put on an ounce. It wasn't until I was in my 30s that I could finally put on weight. My dad was the same when he was young.
     
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  3. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    But most of us can surely spot the difference between a naturally slim young person and an older person who is starving herself to create a certain effect, can't we? That Victoria Beckham/Olson twins look is quite different from the healthy sporty teen. Its quite a scary look, there's an intense strungout-ness to it, and their heads look somehow too big for their bodies.

    I think films depicting too-skinny actresses eating "normally" obscure the nasty reality behind the media's obsession with skinniness, and what many women (especially older women) actually have to do to make it in the media.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2017
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  4. TigerLilea

    TigerLilea Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Okay, I see where you are coming from. Anorexics tend to be very gaunt looking. I guess I'm more sensitive to the word since my nieces started getting called that. :cautious:
     
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  5. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Oh, I'm still taking 10mg daily. Maybe I should try and drop that down a bit? Its a pretty shitty sleep drug anyway.
     
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  6. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    :rofl:
    Hi @Woolie yes I was on ami now nortryptiline and keen on ditching it as you know from my thread about melatonin. Hadn't considered it as a factor in my further weight gain since diagnosis but it probably is. Having said that I've still been taking them while I've lost the 2stone on low carbs.

    And just to add I made myself laugh looking at your post because at a glance I read "a pretty shitty sheep drug" I think your avatar must have influenced that!:rofl:
     
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  7. JCB

    JCB Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yes, and I think there has been a lot of work put into these issues. Just a pity that ME doesn't get that degree of attention.

    When my dad was still around and his doctor had suggested he lose some weight, we talked briefly about the known science. One thing he mentioned was IBAT - Interscapular brown adipose tissue https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_adipose_tissue . I think Horizon on BBC TV had covered it and it was in New Scientist. He light-heartedly blamed the declining function of IBAT for failing to burn off calories. He liked fatty meat. He liked the fat around a slice of pork. He said it was part of his pleasure in life and was inclined to pay the price for that in terms of years lived. However he also did lose weight, perhaps just to show he could. My mum said to me that he just seemed to stop eating. One way to do it perhaps, but it made catering difficult for my mum.

    What I am getting round to is that there are metabolic differences between people and also as we age. In my 'biscuit' I was claiming that for an individual there was only a small diifference between staying at the 'right' weight and gaining a lot over the years. I also reckon there is a difference from person to person in how much each needs to eat to stay at a steady weight.

    Way way back, when I was with my first wife, she bought a book about nutrition and dieting by John Yudkin, something of an academic expert. Part of his thesis was that we have an 'appestat' analagous to a thermostat that helps to tell us when to stop eating. This can vary from person to person, some find theirs is set higher and they get heavier, just as room can get overheated. He also had the opinion that people with more active lives tended to have better regulation. He was not saying you need to exercise to burn of fat, but rather that this appestat works better generally for more active, healthier people.

    So being ill does make the whole thing more difficult for us, robbing us of our natural mechanism to maintain our weight. In my adult life I have had a tendency to gain weight. I was chubby as a child, but like a beanpole in my teens, then as an adult had a tendency to gain weight slowly. This was exacerbated when I started travelling for work, eating hotel dinners and socialising in the bar.

    But things definitely went haywire as I developed ME, before I knew it ws ME and while I was still working, but no longer travelling to the same extent. To put it another way, my weight rocketed during the year before I stopped working, 14 pounds in that year and another 7 pounds in the six months after I stopped. I was still active during that last year at work.

    I seem to have gone on a bit there. Let's talk about cats instead.

    Cats don't have a sweet tooth. I have been told that they actually lack the taste buds for sweet. Yet another genetic abnormality.

    So would you actually be happier if the cat got fat and you could actually put her through the rigours of weight watch boot camp? :)
     
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  8. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Haha! Maybe I should try counting myself to get to sleep?

    Still, if you can lose all that weight and still be on it, then I'm kind of convinced its not a huge threat. So perhaps it only adds weight by enhancing appetite a little.
     
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  9. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Sure, it takes different people different amounts of calories to maintain their current weight. A lot of the factors that determine this are boring and immovable, like gender and age and how much muscle bulk you tend to acquire.

    But beyond that, its probably not useful to talk of "genetic" factors that affect weight, because this does not explain the more proximal factors that are actually responsible for the variability. Some of those "genetic" factors are probably mediated by personality and behaviour - people have different temperaments, some are intense and goal-driven, others are relaxed, more pleasure seeking. Some people get great pleasure out of food, others less so. Some people need to be constantly active, others can be quite happy to chill indefinitely. All these characteristics are probably genetically determined. Just saying something's "genetic" isn't useful. It kind of ends the conversation, because people think "nothing I can do about that". The explanation is too distal.

    On the topic of metabolism: When I trained as a fitness instructor many years ago, they encouraged us to think of calories and weight not as a subtractive equation (where you calculate your daily caloric needs, and aim for a calorie intake that is less than this), but rather as a sort of homeostatic function. So you can upset the homeostatis by dropping calories, but this in itself also alters the homeostatic balance, so you will need to then eat less permanently to maintain the new balance.

    Rather than calories in-calories out, a better way to think of weight loss is disrupt-maintain.

    This is kind of a useful way of thinking, because it encourages people to think of weight loss as a change in lifestyle, rather than a single goal with an endpoint. It also explains why weight loss gets increasingly hard as we get close to our end goal.

    Another advantage of this type of thinking is that encourages you to consider modifiable changes other than food deprivation that might help to shift the homeostasis, such as increasing muscle bulk (which raises basal metabolic rate). Obviously, some of those aren't open to us. :(
     
  10. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Hi all a quick update I was away staying with family the weekend of 4/5 Nov. This involved significant departures from low carb. Namely fish and chips for tea on Saturday with mushy peas and a full 3 course Sunday dinner with Yorkshire pud, a couple of glasses of wine and desert of chocolate brownie with a scoop of ice cream.
    When I got home I had only put on 2lbs and I've lost them again now. So I'm really pleased that it wasn't a big blip.
    Obviously the barrage of food that is Christmas is going to be more of a challenge but I'm a bit less concerned at the prospect now.
     
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  11. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    @NelliePledge, a bummer you had to break your diet - but if you really enjoyed it, then it should count as a nice "break". And we all need the occasional break.

    Its good to be able to integrate the diet into a normal life, as it were (or as close as normal as we PwMEs can get).

    But maybe you ate some those things just to please your hosts, and didn't even enjoy them all that much? I wonder if you can get around that problem in future by warning people you're on a special diet (bang on about your health and your doctor or something). Then people won't go making nice things just for you.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
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  12. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Oh no @Woolie nobody was forcing anything on me that I didn't want. They are all really pleased I'm losing weight. What I had was still less than I used to eat even tho carbs were included. Eg The chip shop meal was in the cafe not a massive take away. it is mainly pensioners who go in that cafe so it was a pensioner size portion. :D
     
  13. Yessica

    Yessica Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    Hi, @Woolie and everyone. I heard the end of this tonight on a show called The Moth. It was so funny. I'll have to listen to all of it. Thought you might enjoy it too.

    https://themoth.org/stories/oreo-relapse

    I can relate being one that can't have a bag of anything good to eat and not eat it all that same day, if lucky it might last 2 days. No will power at all if it's around!

    The only thing that has worked for me in the past is counting calories and making it a lifestyle (controlling portion sizes). As of late what's working is just not having enough due to health and circumstances.

    It's really great you are doing this thread and supporting each other with this. When I did Weight Watchers years ago, I found the weekly weigh in helped a lot and surprisingly the little gold star they gave for losing a pound or two helped, made me feel like a happy kid who received a gold star for doing well in school.

    I needed to lose 40 pounds back then. I found also looking at it in smaller increments helped too. I'd either just look at it each time as I need to loose 2 pounds or sometimes I'd look at it as 5. If I looked at it as 40 it was too overwhelming, I'd get discouraged, it would seem like it could never happen.

    It's not easy. Keep it up. It will happen. Slowly but surely. It's exciting to hear what you learn and of your successes along the way.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2017
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  14. Viola

    Viola Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    I put up a lot of weight when I was on Amyriptyline. I don't think it was totally down the the drug as my diet was not as good then. I think i lost some weight with difficulty on it for a while and then I switched to Prothiaden that didn't have this effect for me (though it is not as sedating). I lost quite a bit of weight over the next few years and managed to maintain mostly (the odd time it would sneak up a bit but I could get it down, slowly normally)

    A few months ago out of desperation after my sleep had been bad for over a year I decided to try Amytriptyline again. I was ok for about a week, then i started to get hungier and hungier and I put up 8-9 pounds in 2 weeks! I was ravenous after this time and also had a hankering for junk good, which is very unusual.

    I had started to eat crap the last time I was on this drug but I thought it was just me. The hunger and junk food craving were so dramatic this time I knew it was the drug so I came off it. It wasn't really working for me for the sleep problem anyway.

    So it might be causing a weight-gain issue but it might not. It can be worth trying other drugs to see. I tried surmontil and felt awful on it, chest pains and much worse dizinness. I tried it twice (actually i think 3 times) with a few months gap in between and had the same thing happen both times. Never again.

    I am on Prothiaden and a sleeping tablet now. It hasn't fixed the sleep problem yet but it is better than it was.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017
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  15. Viola

    Viola Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    I am a freak of nature. Don't feel you have to read this as it is me rambling about my odd weight ups and downs.

    I mentioned last week (I think!) that I seem to have suddenly jumped up in weight again. I may as well use figures as this is so odd. I had gotten town to 57 kilos a few weeks ago, which is almost my goal weight. It then went up a bit (not really a problem as slight ups and downs are normal).

    Then suddenly my weight went up to 58.4kilos then 59.5kilos. This was I think in less than 2 weeks, at a time where I should have either been maintained or losing weight from how I was eating.

    I was at my parents house and weighed myself with their scales which was also reading a similar result (it weighs me slightly lower than my own but still close enough).

    Then I cam back to my own place last Sunday night and when i weighed in Monday morning it had now gone up to 61.5 kilos. Now I knew there was no way on earth i had put up 2 kilos in 2 days, so I figure at least some of this is water-weight or else something really odd is going on (maybe I am growing an alien baby and don't know it :nailbiting:). My stomach made me look pregnant (this happens to me sometimes).

    I thought I was just going to have to get used to eating a bit less and see what happens. I did this at the beginning of the week but increased what I was eating over the week so now am eating normally (not a weight losing amount) for me.

    Well, alien baby seems to vanished. I basically "lost" 4 kilos over 5 days (going down consistently either a kilo or a good part of a kilo every day).

    I don't really have an explanation other than that I had eating more salty food last week (but I wouldn't expect it to count for that much) and my hormones. Still really odd though. It has never been that weird, though I get some blips but usually just up or down a kilo at most.

    So I am almost back to where I was at my lowest a few weeks ago (it said 57.3 this morning). I hope it stays off as i would love to get into maintenance-mode as it is a lot easier I think.

    I was so disheartened when the weight kept going up and up (I'd stand on the scales and think WTF :confused:) and it is a relief to get it off. I thought it would take me months to lose it as I normally lose weight very slowly.

    Anyway I know a lot of people here are further away from their goal than I am, and it might sound stupid to worry about weight at this level, but I just resent the extra weight Amitryptline gave me and I find for me if i don't keep an eye on my weight it can slowly creep up and it takes me ages to lose it. I also wasn't fitting into some clothes I have that i like, and I feel a little more comfortable with a little bit lower weight than i have now (it doesn't make the ME better but just I feel more physically comfortable).

    Unfortunately a lot of my excess weight seems to be around my belly, which is the worst place for it to be. When I was younger I was not like this. There is nothing really i can do about this as I can't exercise, so I hope if i keep my weight on the lower-half of a healthy BMI that that is the best I can do and it might remove some of it.

    So I am much relieved (well unless it is all back tomorrow, and I was at a pot-luck tonight and ate a lot, so nothing would surprise me :laugh:)
     
  16. alicec

    alicec Established Member (Voting Rights)

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    The 5:2 diet is continuing to work well for me. Have lost another 2 kg in a bit under a month and still find the diet quite sustainable.

    I'm a bit inclined to gastritis so sometimes on the restricted days I found my stomach hurting a bit and wanting more food. Chewing on a DGL lozenge has settled this down well and helped to resist the more food demand.
     
  17. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    That's so weird. Its sounds like you've ruled out problems with scales. I suppose it must be some sort of fluid retention?
    Part of that is the inevitable effects of age (assuming you're not young, that is). As you get older, the fat you have - even if its not much - redistributes more to the tummy and your legs, thigh and arse get less of it.

    As I understand it, you can't redistribute fat through exercise anyway. Healthies can strengthen their abdominal muscles, which might help a bit. But its probably a small effect.
     
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  18. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Welcome, @Yessica, nice to see you here!

    Oh this Oreo relapse thing is so funny! I know just what he means about "blacking out" when eating, especially when you do it in front of the tv. You look down at the pack... and where did those bikkies/nuts/chips/crackers all go?

    A thing of the past for me... haven't munched anything in front of the tv for two whole months!
    Yea, that helps me too when I'm unwell. Since I've cut out "easy" foods (bread, crackers, biscuits, etc), it just takes more effort to prepare something. And if I'm really unwell, I just end up leaving it longer before I eat.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017
  19. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Don't know how I missed this - congratulations, @alicec!

    I'm very impressed the 5 and 2 is working for you. But scared to try it myself, those 2 days must be really tough on your body.
     
  20. MErmaid

    MErmaid Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Greetings everyone; I am late to this thread. From reading your posts, I felt inspired to address my weight gain. I just started today, going back to my previous routine of eating 2 meals per day (when I was 30 pounds less). So fingers crossed, I am hoping to be 10 pounds less by New Years!
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017

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